First of all, I'm requesting the mods don't kill this thread and/or lock it. It's not really a request for a suggestion, more like just sharing an idea that came to me.

Second of all, before anyone jumps to any conclusions as to why this idea would not work, I want everyone to keep an open mind and read the entirety of my post. I've thought long and hard about this.

So... here's a moveset I came up with for my Shuckle.

@ Bright Powder
Relaxed | Sturdy
252 HP, 129 Df, 129 Sp Df
Double Team
Substitute
Power Trick
Earthquake/Stone Edge/Rock Slide

First six turns: Double Team. I believe six times is the maximum times you can use it.
Seventh turn: Substitute.
Eighth turn: Power Trick.
Nineth turn: Earthquake/Stone Edge/Rock Slide.

Before anyone jumps to any conclusions, let me explain myself, because I know what you're thinking. "That's going to make Shuckle's defensive stat terrible!" But let's go over this. Have you ever battled something that used an evasion move SIX times? I have, and I had no chance to hit it unless I was packing Shockwave (see next paragraph). Plus, I've never used the Bright Powder, but theoretically, this would make my evasion astronomical.

Yes, I know there are further flaws. Never-missing moves. Can someone list all of them for me, because I can only think of three: Aerial Ace, Magical Leaf, and Shockwave. First of all, these will do NOTHING to Shuckle with the ridiculous defensive stats mine will have under its belt.

Basically, the strategy is to screw the opponent by making it impossible to hit until it doesn't matter anymore. Besides, hopefully, with near maximum HP and near maximum defenses, AND abysmal accuracy, the Substitute won't be knocked out (if at all) until the turn right after Shuckle uses Power Trick thanks to its now toilet-worthy defense. By then, it's too late, and BAM! Power Shuckle for the win.

I don't know whether I should go with Earthquake, Stone Edge, or Rock Slide. Probably one of the latter, because if the opponent finds out my plan and switches to a flying-type or Levitate holder, that won't be good.

Other things to note are that I do not plan on using this more than once in a battle (otherwise I'll just be too predictable, more than likely) and I won't use it more than once on one opponent, ever. That being said, I'll avoid being predictable and if I do go the Stone Edge route, I won't really have to worry about the lowly 5 PP.

I could sweep pokemon out faster with a more conventional pokemon, but this is just an idea for one of those oh-so-fun, annoying-as-hell movesets that make your opponent go like "WTF mate ." What do you guys think of this strategy? I couldn't help but toy around with the idea of a Power Trick Shuckle.

Double Team is a cheap move that is generally banned in competitive play.

^I'd like to hear a reason why Double Team is cheap. It seems perfectly fair to me, it just sucks if you're on the receiving end. :roll:

well my friend. u have ALOT of time on ur hands buti do think u are a poke genious. thts incredible. i like ur thinking.

I think It's a good idea. Your opponent would probably think " Man is this Shuckle desperate" and then BAM!!! outta nowhere they get KOed.

It makes battles a game of chance rather than skill, just like ubers and OHKO moves (and Minimize). Anyone can win using these tactics.

Other than the evasion (which leaves you open for status effects like Toxic), I think the Substitution + Power Swap Combo is great. But, heres something to think of before hand.

Before using Shuckle, have a pokemon with U-turn and Sleep Powder (Or yawn, or any other sleeping type move.) Put the opponent to sleep, U-Turn, Power Swap, then nuke. Also, I'd replace the Bright Powder with the quick claw, since there is a slight chance that the opponent can wake up before you can use Power Swap.

^^(@eamonn)That's not really the point, though. A monkey can win using a Toxi-trapper but it's still a very popular, cookie-cutter idea anyway.

No, that isn't very good. It's good up to the attacking move. Shuckles have absolutly horrible attack stats. It would be better to fit toxic in there, and replace power trick with bide, but only if you give it toxic.

Power Swap would take it's defense and switch it with it's Attack. Also, using Toxic also conflicts with people who use Safeguard beforehand.

The problem with that is that given the moveset I'm using, Shuckle HAS to be slow. See, let's say I use Power Trick, being the slower, at the end of the turn. That only gives the opponent the chance to get rid of the Substitute right before I Stone Edge it into next Tuesday. Now let's say I went first and used Power Trick. The opponent would attack next, kill my substitute, and unless I use Power Trick again (completely destroying the foundation of my set), I'm screwed.

You bring up a very solid point. Ok, combine the two ideas together. Put the opponent to sleep, then switch to Shuckle who uses Substitute, then power swap shortly after.

Now why do you think people use that strategy, Taser? Because it works. Because it's a strong, clean strategy. As I said, Double Team, and moves like it, make battles a game of chance rather than skill. Yes, a monkey can win using a Toxi-trapper, but at least counter-offensives can be launched. Skill can win the game back. With Double Team, you can't even hit the opponent.

Go with that you like, Taser. But don't expect your opponents to be impressed by your "skill".

Rawr! Geez, there's no need to make personal attacks. :roll: I'm not trying to show off "skill" with this moveset, I'm trying to have some fun, throw my opponent off guard, and show that I can think of creative movesets.

I don't care if you like it. That's not my problem. But the personal attacks are completely uncalled for.



You also have a good idea going. There is a small flaw, because some pokemon that know Rest have the Chesto equipped, waking them up... but, that isn't a bad idea at all, either.

Personal attacks? You haven't seen my personal attacks, and you don't want to.

You make good, creative movesets. Your Umbreon set gives testament to that. But I stand by what I said. Double Team is cheap.

Oops, sorry. I thought he meant trick room, not power swap, but it would leave it extremly vulnerable to the enemy.

^^OK, and I don't mind if you think that. I think it's cheap (as I would hope most people would) when I see freaking kids on here with their teams consisting of Arceus, Darkrai, Mewtwo, Rayquaza, Groudon, and Kyogre.

It's not even like I'd over use it, really.... Shuckle is one out of the 90-something pokemon I am going to train for Wi-Fi battle, and the chances of my even using this idea for tournaments and actual competitive play is slim. It's really just for some fun. I mean, the first time someone on this forum pointed out the idea of Power Trick Shuckle, I laughed.

I'm hoping you will come to respect me as a trainer even though you find some of my sets cheap. I don't mind if you don't like it, all I ask is that you respect me, and not insinuate that I am unskilled.

Point is, I don't think it's cheap, as long as I don't abuse it.



Re-read my post. The point is that because Shuckle is so slow, and in conjunction with Substitute and Double Team, that vulnerability will be gone.

BTW, this "he" is a "she."

I don't recall saying that moveset was "cheap". It's completly stragetic. The only thing in pokemon that actually is "cheap" is a person who has a team full of legendaries. They need to realize that there is other good pokemon besides legendaries.

Swift.

Which, if I remember correctly, got switched over to a Special-type attack, rather than Physical. Shuckle's defense would probably minimize damage, but Swift is the original "never miss" move.

You've defnitely got something going for the Shuckle and I, for once, am relieved to see that the ol' D-Team combo hasn't gone anywhere. IMHO, it is far from "cheap", no worse than using say... ToxiTrapper to Poison YOUR ENTIRE TEAM AND LEAVE YOU FOR DEAD. Not bitter, I swear.

Keep yer head up and let 'em whine. That would be a Shuckle *I'd* like to use. If, y'know, I had the patience to raise one...

Sheesh...if Taser fights with all these awesome tactics, I'm afraid to go up against her in any type of battle. Yeah, but putting Double Team aside, theres no other use for shuckle rather than being a Toxic trapper, right? I mean, the whole point of your double team strategy is so that even though it's defense is gone, it still won't be knocked out.

I wasn't saying you said that. I was talking to eamonn.

I've already said that ubers are cheap. The six you mentioned were ubers.

I also never said that you lacked skill, merely that using Double Team makes it seem so.

And I'm not going to bother arguing with Psypoke members about legal moves. Considering they're from Psypoke, it's pointless.

Just a sec there, I have a problem with that statement. Your saying that all people from psypoke use ubers or cheap moves, that will give them a determined win? But from what I see, there are some very intelligent people here with amazing tactics to get around strong pokemon. A tactic is just as good as the pokemon you use them on. Strategy and strong pokemon both reflects the skill of that trainer, I believe that statement 100%

Also one side note...arn't you a psypoke member as well?

There are, yes, but they are few.

And no, I'm not a Psypoke member. I only joined to obtain rare Pokes, and to see the level of battling. Of the forums I visit, this is the least.

Look, I wouldn't consider that "arguing." I was merely defending myself, which I had a right to do. You can stand by your points, which are perfectly valid, and I can stand by mine, which are also perfectly valid.

Like I said, I don't consider it cheap since I have no plans of abusing it. One time per battle per ONE person doesn't really seem like "abusing." So thanks for your opinions, but I'll just shut up now since apparently I'm "arguing."