True, but multiply it by 3.375 and you get 151.875. Anyway, let's let tiger and snow test them out.

Whatever... it's just that it'd be a ton better on something else... anyway, lets just let them test it, who knows? It could work.

Wewt, time for my next Creative Moveset: Tanking Gardevoir!

Gardevoir @ Leftovers
252 Sp. Def, 252 HP, 6 Sp. Att.
Calm | Trace/Synchronize
- Mean Look
- Toxic/Will-o-wisp
- Wish/Calm Mind
- Psychic

Simple: You mean look a pokemon that can't kill you, Toxic/Will-o-Wisp it, then the path splits: if you went Wish, then you Psychic away until Wish activates, then you set up Wish again. If you went Calm Mind, then you CM up and when you're at max, you Psychic away. CM/Wish makes you last longer, Mean Look for trapping and Toxic/WoW for consistant damage/lowering attack. Psychic for an attack.

There are some similar sets, but none that are really like this one. Try it out and see if it works.

Because I don't have much time to tend to the others at the moment, I'll only comment on this one because it requires the least amount of looking into.

On daveshan's Togetic, I have no doubt that it works. Not an alternative to a standard, however it's already in the HoF. I posted a similar set, with the only difference as Return for Swift, some months ago. It's not the best choice for a Physical Sweeper for its Attack stat, but it can still do what you need it to.

I can't remember if anyone posted one like this, so here's my physical sweeping Wailord

@ Leftovers
Adamant | Either, probably water veil
30-HP 120-Att 180-SD 180 Def
>Substitute
>Rest
>Snore
>Earthquake


Lefties and Rest are for HP, pretty standard, raised attack from base 90 takes advantage of Earthquake, and everything that flies or levitates gets hit by Snore while asleep because they'll do a good bit o damage.

The only problem I can see here is Gengar with levitate (I think) but I can't remember if Snore still affects it.

A question if someone could answer it: Why do people use Choice Band? It disables 3 of 4 attacks, which severely limits attacking ability, which I found when someone switched items with me because they wanted my leftovers during a battle.

Hurray my moveset is in the HoF!

What about physical Umbreon?
@Shell bell nature: Adamant
Curse
Screech
Double edge
Wish

Curse for increase the force of double edge, Screech For lowering foe defences, Double edge for damage and wish for recover from the damage taken from double edge,it is good, it have problem with ghosts but I destroyed a Agron with this Umbreon.

Yes, I can see how that happened. Killer defenses boosted by curse, average speed less than affected, and Aggron's not high on the SA index anyway. Why double-edge though? I'd have said something without recoil, and umbreon has moonlight, which I'd say was better than wish because wish has to plan ahead quite a bit. Maybe Shadow Ball?

Well, if neither get a STAB, then I'd say return over double-edge.

I'd probably say Return on that one because it has the highest base damage without horrible side-effects of all of its Physical sweeping moves. only problem is Dusclops/Gengar are extremely common these days. Doesn't hit anything for double-damage, but still has some mad power.

And definately Moonlight over Wish.

Wenziz's set makes perfect sense, although it has Gengar problems. However, Wailord is rather UU, so it probably wouldn't face one in everyday metagame. Gengar can sweep the hell out of this, with Thunderbolt and immunity to both of its attacks, as well as outspeeding it and high special attack.

Togetic (wenziz's): The Physical one won't work because of the lack of the Attack stat. On the Special, I don't see much that it can do other than Substitute, Softboiled, Substitute, (etc) and keeping on losing a gradual, or possibly a lot, of HP. Not mentioning that you don't have much behind your attacks. Even if you're aiming at just stalling, it won't do too well.

Magmar: I'm leaning more towards this being an alternate standard, but a second opinion might be needed here.

Exploud: I believe that strategy is a standard, and, if not, is going to become a standard.

Mantine: Worth a test, I suppose, although I may end up trying a few changes here and there.

Walrein: Snore doesn't do much for damage, but I'll get to do a little more for editing when that's being tested as well.

Gardevoir: If it's Calm Mind and Will-O-Wisp, then it's not going to be very creative. However, just a Toxi-trapping one would suffice. I doubt that it would have too good of an outcome, though. The lack of Defense can be altered easily, but I doubt that it would be enough to protect you in the long run. I'll just get around to managing that, too.

Wailord: As with Walrein, Snore isn't going to do much. Anyway, once you Substitute, it's just going to be taken away, and it's not like someone would keep putting it up just to keep on losing HP. Also, it's not much of a Physical Sweeping set if you only have one good damaging move. I personally don't see much to do with this, so a second opinion would work it out.

On the Choice Band question, it also multiplies a Physical Attack used by 1.5, which is why it's only used on Physical Sweepers with only attacking moves, except for the case that it's being switched to another Pokemon.

Umbreon: This could do better with Moonlight for Wish, Return and Shadow Ball for Screech, as Curse should be enough. I'm not thinking that it would do too well, but I suppose it can be changed around a little while testing.

So, those to be tested are Venusaur, Walrein, Mantine, Walrein, Gardevoir and Umbreon. Second opinions for Magmar and Wailord. Don't expect the results too soon, though.

I don't see much in the Wailord and Walrein.

Situation:

"Hello, I am a gengar w/thunderbolt."
"Hi, I am a wailord/walrein that can only attack w/snore and EQ."
"I, the gengar, will now pawn you."

Same situation goes for aerodactyls and skarmorys along with any other ghost w/levitate.

Okay, so I got two done more quickly than I expected:

Venusaur: It did okay a few times, but the rest wasn't very okay. It was pretty limited even to do what it could, so that didn't help much. It would usually live to Leech Seed or Toxic them, and then use Rest or just have them switch out to a certain sweeper or healer if they've already got a few under status conditions. I don't think it did well enough, even with all the edits I tried with it.

Walrein (the older): This didn't have much of a way of healing itself and thus ended up having an early knock out. However, it did bring down a fair amount of enemies. I found that it worked well with either Yawn, as it bought some time, or Rest and Chesto, as it would heal better. Good for HoF, I suppose.

So, I'll add the Walrein set and edit the test list.

Gardy: It doesn't have the defenses to survive long enough for CM to make a difference. You can't have Wish and MeanLook in the same moveset, and without a healing move, Gardy didn't last. In short, good idea, but no banana.

Umbreon: I'll test this more tomorrow. I'd give it Lefties to hold, and use Return. I geve it EVs of 252 Att, 252 HP, and 6 Def. It didn't do too well today, but I'll test some more tomorrow if possible.

Yes, I was wondering if just this Monveset would be better for (Slowking) or (Slowbro)?

Slowbro/Slowking @ King's Rock
Flamethrower
Sunny Day
Psychic
Yawn

I just want to know who it is better for and this would be a double battle Pokemon, I don't want to know about the EV's!

Doesn't matter. The only difference is in their Defense stats; Slowbro has better Def and worse Sp. Def, Slowking has better Sp. Def and worse Def. In general, I would say go for Slowking, as most of that family's weaknesses are Special-based attacks.

And, in the future, this is not a rating thread, it is for suggesting creative/uncommonly used movesets for competitive battling.

It's not a very good moveset anyway. The standard set has Slowbro using calm mind instead of sunny day. That way, it helps psychic and flamethrower instead of just flamethrower and leaving itself vunerable to solarbeam.

Generally, tiger and snow don't like people doing their jobs, but I think they'll agree that the moveset is worse than the standard and won't be going into the HoF.

Agreed, I don't remember too clearly, but wouldn't it be interesting if Slowbro/king could learn Thunder?

Thunder-RD-Surf plus Psychic or Flamethrower?

Well, you wouldn't want flamethrower if you have rain dance. But, no, Slowbro/Slowking can't learn thunder. It's best special moves are: psychic, fire blast, blizzard, and surf. Most of the time, you replace blizzard with calm mind since flamethrower/fire blast takes care of grass.

Agreed agreed, very true.

Now, I haven't seen one like this, but then I haven't read about 40 pages of the 61 we have here in Creatives.

@ Lum Berry
Keen Eye | Modest
252-SA 252-SD 6-HP
>Surf
>Ice Beam
>Shock Wave
>Mist/Substitute/Water Sport

Fairly standard except for Shock Wave, I've yet to see one with it. But if you changed it slightly and said...

>Shock Wave
>Double Team
>Supersonic/Swagger/Attract
>Toxic

What about that? Or even...

Keen Eye | Careful/Hasty
252-Def 252-SD 6-HP
>Toxic/Shock Wave/Steel Wing/Aerial Ace
>Stockpile
>Swallow
>Substitute/Spit Up/Attract/Double Team

Sort of a toxi-tanker, I think, except that Stockpile usually goes with Spit Up as well. Possibly combine Attract with Substitute instead of Toxic. Hasty Nature increases its speed and the sacrifice of Defense means little compared to what it gets including EVs, but Careful natures work even better since it won't need any SA.


Comments people?

I've cooked up another one: Toxistalling Steelix

Steelix @ Chesto/Lefties
252 HP, 136 Sp. Def, 120 Def.
Impish | Sturdy
- Toxic
- Block
- Rest
- Rock Slide/Iron Tail

Simple, you Block something that won't get a powerful Water Attack on you, Toxic it, and then RS/IT until you get weak. Then Rest up and start over. When the foe faints, switch out to an Electric spec. sweeper to scare away the Water that'll most likely come in. When he switches, you Thunder Wave then Sweep.

Slowbro/Slowking: As JsXtm said, this is not a rating center and similar questions should be posted in the rating center and not here.

Pelipper(s):

The first: Water Sport and Mist aren't needed, and that just leaves it as too standard.

The second: You're pretty likely to get attacked before Double Team is fully up, especially with a Thunderbolt. One hit and you're down, but that's usually to be expected with Pelipper anyway. You also don't have anything to trap your opponent to prevent that from happening. I don't think it will work, so unless there's another opinion, it won't go.

The third: I don't care much for Stockpile strategies because they require Stockpile to get powered up every single time. They just don't work.

Steelix: I've tried out most of the creative Steelix sets you can think of, and that's definitely one of those strategies. You can browse back a few pages for that discussion or just search the forum if you want to check out that discussion.

Ah yes, the era of a thousand steelix movesets by JsXtm.

Hey, I kinda enjoyed that Era.
But yeah, anyway, I had an obsession there for a while with getting a creative moveset into the HoF for every one of the pokemon on my Midnight ID, IE {charizard}{gyarados}{steelix}{kabutops}{snorlax}. At that point, everybody but Steelix already had one, so I went to work trying to find something (anything) that would work and be creative. The end result, after probably about a dozen movesets I submitted, was the one that sNOwBaLL posted, which was prettty much jointly thought up by me and tiger10x. But anyway, I highly doubt that there is much of anything else that can be done with Steelix in the way of creative movesets.