In response to Krisp's post...



This is a thread to discuss the black movement at its current state. Should there be a need for black pride anymore? It's been many, many years since slavery was outlawed and although racism will never fully be extinguished, should there be TV channels like BET and other various groups to heighten black status?

Everyone fully understands that African Americans are a minority, just like Latinos and other people not white. Everyone also clearly understands that White America was not the first foundation of the land and that the true Americans, Native Americans, were pushed out, enslaved, wiped out, etc... America is considered a majority 'white' country, so let's not be naive and bring up arguments about "well everyone is a foreigner and apart of a minority because of ancestry'".

To say the debt has been payed for all the crimes we have committed against African Americans in this country is foolish. However, all things must come to an end. Slavery has ended, but segregation still exists even though it's not in the books.

My points are few: Some members of the African American community segregate themselves because they feel the need to protect their heritage. All I know is... If there was a channel called White Entertainment Television, good ol' Rev. Al Sharpton would be all up in arms. Yes, I understand that most news networks and other networks could be considered 'white' TV, but why label it? After all, if it's truly a free country where each man is equal and has the same opportunities as everyone else, why label such mindless things?

I also have a problem with walking into the local Wal-Mart at (granted) 11:00 and being greeted to african americans dressed in such a manner to intimidate me. It's not as if they're loitering or anything to begin with, but they just happen to snicker as I walk by. It also bugs me in schools how I've had to deal with people who I cannot understand one word they're saying. Is that English or illiterate mumbles? Different races will have their own distinct culture and dialect. This much I understand. But why should people put on such an act if it's not instinct? What's the intimidation for? Are you afraid of being advanced upon and must put on a tough exterior in retaliation?

There are many inconsistencies that run amok, and while I can personally not address all of them, perhaps a select few of you can in a distinguished and mature-like way. A lot of points and opinions can be expressed through human psychology. I just wonder what Martin Luther King Jr. would say today, after all the work he did to ensure mixture of blacks and whites, that members of the African American community choose to distance themselves with such music, or television, etc.

Also, if anyone can come up with a more suitable title to this thread, then please inform me. I could not find the words to express what the title should be. Let me know.

CNN, MSNBC, and Fox News aren't directly appealing to the white person, so I don't consider them white TV. BET appeals to black people, hence why its called Black Entertainment Television, I don't see any W's in those acronyms, so they aren't really intended for just white people (unless you replace the C's to stand for Caucasian, Caucasian News Network anyone?)

I think he would tell them that they have taken a step back. I think that he would CUT OBAMA'S BALLS OFF slap Jesse Jackson for being so stupid. He wouldn't have marched in the Jena 6 or whatever that was. He would try to make Auburn Avenue a mixed neighborhood instead of an insanely populated area for black people. He would try to improve inner city schools and try to tell rappers and the like to stop infiltrating young people with their corrupted lyrics and disgusting wardrobe. There actually was a small movement started by Phat Farm CEO who said that rap music really should tone it down, but it fell through quickly.

Modern day segregation isn't the largest issue at stake, yet I find it funny because all the black people I know (I know some black people OMG :O) tell everyone that they want to 'just blend in with the rest of society' ... yet they have stuff like BET and BHM. Ironic. I don't look down on them, segregate them, they're just another person to me, nothing special. I'm not racist in any way at all, just fyi, I hold no contempt whatsoever for black people.

Please note, I say black and not African American because if you were born in America, you're American, not African-American, you're only African-American if you come from Africa, in which most of the souths slaves at least came from the Caribbean, who came from Africa, yet one generation was born in the Caribbean therefore making them ...Caribbean-American? O.o Whatever.

Edit: I hope you didn't change the title and it was a joke by the mods. >_>

BET is ignorance manifested. I am white, but 95% of people i know excludeing family are black. All of them in college think BET is ****, but most of the high schoolers eat it up.

I live in England and haven't heard of these channels, but they are so hypocritical.

If they want to be treated as an equal then why make an entire channel dedicated to emphasizing the divide?
I think it is riduculous, it is basically supporting racism, for racism to be wiped out there shouldn't be Black Parade's,
or White Parade's, because we are still showing that there is a difference.

edit; Antigue, yeah racism is still very much an issue and we do have a multi-cultural community.
Racism is more directed at the Middle-eastern community (for obvious, narrow-minded views) than Africans, but it is still there.

Ha. I assure you it was not me, just one of our friendly moderators. Which it's fine with me. The post now gets more hits because of it!

Prof. Dom, I wonder does racism exist dominantly in England? I understand, or have read, that there is a large population of muslims over there. But do you experience the same daily thing with blacks?

And the reason I said African American before is that black seems to cliche to use. It's like calling Native Americans 'Indian' to me. Perhaps it's not the same though.

aha, i feel like i'm sort of responsible for this thread. my response to black people (and gay people, spanish people, and whoever else feels like they aren't treated right) is that they're people. but, what bothers me about the black people i don't like, i'm going to put in list form:

- they feel like white people owe them something. (we got you into slavery, but we also got you out of it. additionally, we got you out of africa. i'm sure you're all dying to go back.)
- they look for racism in everything. (ex. transformers.)
- they get offended when you insult ebonics. (it's a bastardization* of the english language, and it's not part of your culture. if you have a problem with how we perceive it, stop speaking it.)
- if you dislike a black person, it's ONLY because they're black.

i've had a lot of positive experiences with black people, and i've had an equal amount of negative experiences with them. one previous black friend, instead of saying hello, greeted me with, "you've gained weight!" it was apparently a compliment, though.

* i'll censor that if you need me to. i just don't understand how blocking out letters removes how offensive the word supposedly is.

I understand, badvibrations. It's hard going about such a topic without stereotypes coming into play. But that's how stereotypes evolved; some of this has to be true. It's not being racist to point out to someone, "Hey! You sound like you're an ignorant gangbanger! How about going back to school and get rid of the McJob?!" Does this sound racist at face value? Yes, yes it does. But is it true? Yes, yes it quite well is. I went to McDonalds tonight for the first time in a long time and the whole staff was entirely black and all spoke as if they're a monkey without their banana (no pun intended). I'm open to the idea of cultural exchange. It's needed in a Republic, especially if it's only the illusion of a Republic (or "democracy"). But I don't see any cultural importance in "I get money!" and "in da club" and the best yet " the police!" No, I've never lived in the slum (ghetto). No, I don't have relatives in jail. No, I don't speak out against all types of law and order. But I've gone through plenty of **** to know that the pronunciation of such traits in life is vile and stupid.

I try not to prejudge, but body language says a lot. The way you dress largely affects the way you will be perceived that night. Wearing a style that is not of the norm does not make you look unique, it makes you look stupid. Wearing a tank top to show muscles that are overly-defined by skin color does not intimidate me. It just shows an unnecessary primal instinct to play alpha male still exists when everyone is controlled by the government.

We did enslave an entire race. We also freed them. We gave them the same rights we have. But now they slave themselves in stereotypes? One would think with so much "hating" going on that people would try to better themselves and bring them out of poverty. Maybe I'm ignorant though. Perhaps I've just had it to "easy" in life. Maybe some just don't "know any better". Silly silly humans.

hah, yeah. what most black people don't seem to understand is that they created this hole for themselves when it comes to stereotypes. white people are the reason they're living in the ghetto, white people are the reason they're perceived as less intelligent, etc. the thing is, though, they're not always wrong. there's still a whole lot of racism, and when they're getting it from some people it's easy to just assume things.

but, oh, i forgot to mention the number one pet peeve i have, which is ~*~*~ the "n" word ~*~*~. i don't like having it waved in front of my face. if that's what you refer to yourself as, expect the same from me. i'm not going to tremble in fear that you're going to "pop a cap in my ass" or w/e.

Heh, you should watch the Martin Luther King Jr. episode of The Boondocks.

I like Black History Month. It's about the culture of the African American people, and I love culture. I also appreciate Hispanic Heritage Month because it's another month dedicated toward the value of culture. I think both of these are important because they acknowledge what Latinos and Blacks have done in this country. No matter what happens, no matter how much racism we get rid of in this country, the United States of America will always have a predominantly white face on it, so with these months commemorating other races it's like we're saying "hey, even though we are a predominantly white country, this country was created by immigrants from everywhere, from Ghana to Greece, from Brazil to Botswana, and from San Francisco to Spain."

By having these months, another important message that I believe is overlooked very often is preached; Integration, not Assimilation. If we can all live in peace and harmony and have these celebrations, then we show the rest of America, that we are indeed different, instead of trying to ignore it. One thing that's hard for people to grasp is how two things can be equal while still remaining different, which is a problem. I have my black culture, you have your asian culture, she has her native american culture, etc. By coming together and appreciating and acknowledging these different backgrounds, we can do exactly what Dr. King preached: Coming togeht in integration, but coming out the other side the same person you were when you came in (however I don't totally believe that; I do believe you should be a different person when you come out the side because you should have learned from the culture of your fellow Americans).

I also appreciate channels like BET. The shows on BET are shows that (try to) capture African American culture in every day life, which is good, because like I said, culture is wonderful, and learning about it is even better. BET is nothing more than a collection of these shows, and why I don't believe BET itself is necessary, I think these shows are. There are shows all about different cultures, and by getting rid of these shows, we are more assimilating then we are integrating, which is terrible.

I think your post was very though through and I enjoyed reading it. You really did hit the nail on the head. But my concern about BET was what if there was a WET? People would be getting pissy EVEN though it's a TV channel to support a race.

A television station marketed towards an alienated and mostly unclaimed demographic? What an atrocity.

Next thing you know they're going to have stations that target women and gays.

I think that its ok if they feel if they feel so insecure about themselves that they need their own channel. It doesn't effect me at all and it keeps a lot of shows I would rather not watch off of TV that I actually watch.

Though I do think that blacks who believe that they are different enough from the rest of the population that they need this shouldn't complain to much when people treat them differently.

Again, I really don't care that its there because I don't watch it anyways. But the fact that they DID call it black entertainment television instead of the hip hop channel does nothing but create stereotypes. By calling it BET the average Joe assumes it appeals to all back people.

This is one of the most offensive things I've read in a while.

Maybe I'm just not down wit da struggle and the non-white man's burden, but I think channels like BET are just plain stupid. It not only promotes race-based programming but stupid programming at that. It's basically MTV with a smaller demographic. But stupid programming aside...

I believe in a little thing called the melting pot, and for some reason we as a nation haven't been pushing blacks, hispanics, and others to integrate into our society. The Jews, Indians, and Europeans were successful at assimilating into America and yet others outright refuse. The whole point of the metling pot wasn't that every culture would simply co-exist within the boundaries of the US, but that people would bring their customs and blend into American society. I couldn't disagree more with multiculturalism, and this fear of assimilating immigrants and different kinds of people is one of the worst cases of political correctness that exists in America. I don't care about the circumstances of how blacks got here; they (meaning blacks today) aren't entitled to a subculture because of events that none of them were around to experience. Most blacks I know want nothing more than to just be American and that's that, but there's still this hip-hop culture that screws it all up.

Same goes for illegal aliens that invade our country and then refuse to assimilate. Multiculturalism is going to ruin this country, and one need only look at lower California where some places don't even speak English and restaurants are writing menus in Spanish. There was a time when people believed that you had to learn the language, appreciate the country, and assimilate into society and not the other way around if you wanted the kind of life America offered people from around the world.

You can have your culture, fine. Bring your recipes and your clothes and so on. But also recognize that even though Texans and New Yorkers are different, they're held together by a common bond which is American culture and the English language.

Race-based advertising is great for business, I'm sure, but it's not good for a functioning society with a common culture. I side with Teddy Roosevelt when it comes to this idea of a hyphenated America where people are seen as groups rather than one American people.

"The men who do not become Americans and nothing else are hyphenated Americans; and there ought to be no room for them in this country. The man who calls himself an American citizen and who yet shows by his actions that he is primarily the citizen of a foreign land, plays a thoroughly mischievous part in the life of our body politic. He has no place here; and the sooner he returns to the land to which he feels his real heart-allegiance, the better it will be for every good American. There is no such thing as a hyphenated American who is a good American. The only man who is a good American is the man who is an American and nothing else...." -T.R.

I dislike BET if only because it, in my view, supports the idea that blacks should be thought of as African-Americans and not just Americans. A lot of this post likely makes no sense to some of you or seems completely off-topic, but it's the root of my beliefs regarding different cultures and society in America, especially when it's based on something as potentially divisive as race. I'm sure what I believe is "offensive" for some, but then, I find the idea that you're going to live in this country and disrespect its customs and culture offensive myself. If you want to live in a little segregated bubble then maybe you shouldn't be living in my country.

Oh yes, and I also dislike the portrayal of European-Indian history in the first post.

Could you elaborate as to how this was one of the most offensive? It didn't really offend me all too much because it made more sense than it's perception of how it could offend someone.

Nice work Cobalt. Couldn't agree with you more. Maybe you can knock some sense into those silly little politicians up on their pedestal.

If you're not being sarcastic, then thanks. And unfortunately so I'm going to be pulling the lever for McOpenborders.

No, I meant it. That post said all I wanted to say but didn't exactly know how to. Perhaps I should read more.

ITT we spout thinly veiled racist sentiment! The exception being Antigua, who apparently wishes to be about as blatant as possible.