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Pokemon Master
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The main reason people use it, though, is because it can take hits well, and deflect them. Then you can Encore, and the opponent is stuck with a move, and you'll know if it's physical or special, then you can Counter / Mirror Coat, and the opponent can't switch.

;)

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Mon Nov 10, 2008 1:39 pm
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In a way smeargle is overated because can learn all moves, but then again, it's stats suck so bad :(


Mon Nov 10, 2008 5:25 pm
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{pikachu} is not overrated.
I have one level 100 with volt tackle and awesome states.

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Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:29 pm
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pokemon ranger wrote:
In a way smeargle is overated because can learn all moves, but then again, it's stats suck so bad :(

It's not really overrated, it's rated as good as it is. The main reason it's so loved is because it can pass four egg moves at a time to the Ground egg group.

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Tue Nov 11, 2008 12:52 am
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Sonicthehedgehogfan, {pikachu} is definitely overrated.

Pikachu might be excellent in the animé, and even though it learns great moves like Volt Tackle, Thunderbolt, Surf and Hidden Power Ice, it lacks on the stats.

The one good thing Pikachu has is Special Attack, and only witha Light Ball at that. And for a Pikachu to reach its full potential by covering Ground types, you will need Surf. Which you can only get from some spin-off game that died about three years ago.

ShinyHunter, Smeargle might be great for breeding, but the main reson why everybody loves it so much is it's Baton-Passing ability. Smeargle is probably the fourth most used Baton-Passer in competitive play, after Mew, Celebi and Jolteon. It's highest stat is it's speed, which, although is not very good, is enough to set up against a tank like Blissey or Skarmory (another case of Gliskarmblisselia not being as good as everybody says). Spore on the first turn knocks the opponent to sleep, and you can use something like Agility or Dragon Dance to raise your speed. If a faster Pokémon comes in, hang on with Focus Sash and proceed to sweep the best you can, or you could then Swords Dance/Nasty Plot to wreak havoc.

It may seem pretty lousy, but two Wishes later and your opponent will be thinking, "Oh god, not again..."

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Wed Nov 12, 2008 10:24 am
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AKART wrote:

And for a Pikachu to reach its full potential by covering Ground types, you will need Surf. Which you can only get from some spin-off game that died about three years ago.


Oh god, don't forget that in order to use surf, you have to settle for a hardy nature. :frustrated:

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Fri Nov 14, 2008 6:33 pm
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ShinyHunter07 wrote:
pokemon ranger wrote:
In a way smeargle is overated because can learn all moves, but then again, it's stats suck so bad :(

It's not really overrated, it's rated as good as it is. The main reason it's so loved is because it can pass four egg moves at a time to the Ground egg group.

It can pass egg moves?? I never knew that :lol: I guess because I usually only use ditto to breed my pokemon!! :lol:


Fri Nov 14, 2008 6:56 pm
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Quote:
Oh god, don't forget that in order to use surf, you have to settle for a hardy nature.

Not anymore. There was a NPower event that gave different natures.

And AKART, I think it still is a bit, there are better Baton-passers.

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Sun Nov 16, 2008 11:48 am
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Sonicthehedgehogfan wrote:
{pikachu} is not overrated.
I have one level 100 with volt tackle and awesome states.


I don't know what to correct about that statement first. o.o

Pikachu is THE overrated pokemon. He qualifies to be the overrated pokemon mascot. I like pikachu, don't get me wrong, but that doesn't change the fact that he is by far the most overrated pokemon ever.

Need proof? Go outside, and find random people. Ask them what a Gliscor is. Then, an Abomanasnow. Bet most of them won't know. Then ask them what a pikachu is. Bet anything the majority of them will know right away.

And as far as your level 100 one with awesome stats, pikachus best base stat is 90 speed, which is horrible. And even with a light ball, his best base stat is 110 attack, and even then, with his bad speed and pathetic defense, just about any other sweeper can take pikachu down with ease. Not to mention, being forced to use an item just to make a pokemon bearly usable instead of an item that would help tons (like a focus sash to cover his terrible defense) is a big hurt on his ''awesomeness''

The only way pikachu can have stats that can be called awesome is if he's hacked.

Back on topic, I feel lucario is a close 2nd as the most overrated. Ever since that movie, anime fans go gaga over him. Don't believe me? Take a look at Deviantart >.>

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Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:04 am
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pup42512n wrote:


Amen.

Overrated:
Dialga- Dragon-type hyper beam. What utter fail.
Nosepass and his evolution- I don't care how good he is, that should be illegal.
Blissey- All it takes is a decent physical.


Nosepass and his evolution overrated??!!! WUT??????

Caterpie is more overrated, lol

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Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:14 am
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In my opinion, every Pokemon that Nintendo flashes everywhere and says "THIS POKEMON IS PWN" is overrated.

Pikachu is definately overrated, it is in the UU tier and yet in the anime and all over Pokemon prancing around like the best thing to hit the game. And it doesn't even have great stats, not even one 100 base, and while it does have Light Ball, it's still crippled by it's less than stellar speed.

Shaymin, which is only being introduced now, is going to be overrated, as people from Smogon say that Skymin doesn't handle that well, and it's easy to kill.

Also, you don't hear them advertising...say...Blissey (lol) or Tyranitar now do you?

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Sun Dec 14, 2008 3:17 am
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I think Charizard is pretty overrated. I mean it's a good pokemon but every little kid you see is like "Charizard is the PWN". I hate that.

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Sun Dec 14, 2008 6:56 pm
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Then don't hang around little kids.


Tue Dec 16, 2008 5:55 pm
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Anyone who ever played the Card game when it first came out knows why little kids say ''Charizard pwns!''
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Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:34 pm
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BloodRush wrote:
I think Charizard is pretty overrated. I mean it's a good pokemon but every little kid you see is like "Charizard is the PWN". I hate that.


My little brothers friends come over and have big tournaments. All they talk about it Charizard and Mewtwo. I sometimes join them and pwn there charizard with my quagsire that uses surf.

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Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:25 pm
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As soon as I give a little post about Pikachu, everybody starts bullying the poor guy. Where to start...

Face:

Quote:
And as far as your level 100 one with awesome stats, pikachus best base stat is 90 speed, which is horrible. And even with a light ball, his best base stat is 110 attack, and even then, with his bad speed and pathetic defense, just about any other sweeper can take pikachu down with ease. Not to mention, being forced to use an item just to make a pokemon bearly usable instead of an item that would help tons (like a focus sash to cover his terrible defense) is a big hurt on his ''awesomeness''


Seriously, here's a fact that any experienced Pokémon player should know: Base stats aren't directly proportional to max stats. Don't believe me? Check out Psypoke's stat calculator:

Lickilicky: Base Attack--85; Max Attack 295
Metagross: Base Attack--135; Max Attack 405

Let's say they both use Explosion. Metagross has a higher attack, but Lickilicky receives STAB. Multiplying Lickililicky's base 85 by 1.5 gives 127.5. Metagross' 135 is higher. But by multiplying Lickilicky's max attack 295 by 1.5, you get 442.5. A considerable amount higher than Metagross' attack. So Lickilicky's Explosion does more damage than Metagross'.

It's the same with Pikachu. Pikachu's base Special Attack of 50 doubles to give 100 (I wonder how you got 110). But the max stat of 218 doubles to give 436. That's higher than Alakazam's Special Attack, which is a base of 135.

Anyway...

Titan of Lightning:

Quote:
Pikachu is definately overrated, it is in the UU tier


Pikachu is in the UU tier. Big deal. Nidoking is in the UU tier, and yet I have one on one of my teams that can simultaneously take out Blissey, Skarmory, Gliscor, Bronzong and Hippowdon without losing a drop of HP. It can also 2HKO Cresselia. Let's look at another example.
Drifblim. Another UU that I use in OU. The idea is that next in line, Salamence, does a lot more damage than the opponent wants him to. It's basically a 101 Subsitute that passes to Salamence, who gets in an average of three Dragon Dances before knocking the opponent over the horizon.
So the tiers have nothing to do with how you could use them. I will never forget the day I battled a guy who had ubers. Lickilicky Exploded Mewtwo, F.E.A.R. took down Rayquaza, Giratina and Dialga were flinchhaxxed to death by Dunsparce, Ho-oh was quickly cleaned up by Huge Power, Choice Band, Aqua Jet Azumarill, and then Scyther baton-passed an Agility and three Swords Dances to a Magikarp which took down Deoxys-F with Bounce. The tiers are just extra rules you can play by, to avoid facing a Garchomp every time you're using a Clampearl with the Deepseatooth.

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Fri Dec 19, 2008 11:19 am
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Lucario and Skymin.

Mudkip is overrated too. I always see people that asks whether someone lieks them.

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Mon Dec 22, 2008 12:41 am
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I owned many people before with Pikachu.
My team is made out of
Pikachu
Infernape
Shaymin (legit)
Espone
Ralts
Pichu.
I've beat team full of Mewtwos even though non of my pokes have a dark type move.

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Tue Dec 23, 2008 12:54 am
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AKART wrote:
As soon as I give a little post about Pikachu, everybody starts bullying the poor guy. Where to start...

Face:

Quote:
And as far as your level 100 one with awesome stats, pikachus best base stat is 90 speed, which is horrible. And even with a light ball, his best base stat is 110 attack, and even then, with his bad speed and pathetic defense, just about any other sweeper can take pikachu down with ease. Not to mention, being forced to use an item just to make a pokemon bearly usable instead of an item that would help tons (like a focus sash to cover his terrible defense) is a big hurt on his ''awesomeness''


Seriously, here's a fact that any experienced Pokémon player should know: Base stats aren't directly proportional to max stats. Don't believe me? Check out Psypoke's stat calculator:

Lickilicky: Base Attack--85; Max Attack 295
Metagross: Base Attack--135; Max Attack 405

Let's say they both use Explosion. Metagross has a higher attack, but Lickilicky receives STAB. Multiplying Lickililicky's base 85 by 1.5 gives 127.5. Metagross' 135 is higher. But by multiplying Lickilicky's max attack 295 by 1.5, you get 442.5. A considerable amount higher than Metagross' attack. So Lickilicky's Explosion does more damage than Metagross'.



It's the same with Pikachu. Pikachu's base Special Attack of 50 doubles to give 100 (I wonder how you got 110). But the max stat of 218 doubles to give 436. That's higher than Alakazam's Special Attack, which is a base of 135.


First off, When I was refering to 110 Attack, I meant his ATTACK stat, not his special attack stat. Light Ball doubles both attack and special attack. Wonder how you didn't notice that.

Secondly, lets take a look at mr pikachus defense, hp and speed. Regardless of how much damage he could actually pull off, he is pathetically slow and frail, and pretty much any sweeper with decent speed will tear him down before he has a chance.

Lets look at Medicham for instance. It's max attack is only 240, but pure power makes it 480, which makes him capable of dealing massive damage. However, his speed, hp, and defenses are poor, and he can easily be taken down with just a bit of effort. Of course, if used right he can be a menace, but anyone who knows what they're doing can finish him off pretty quickly.

Any good sweeper needs speed or bulkiness, and pikachu just doesn't have either. I don't care how well Nidoking, Lickilicky, or any of those UUs you named do, pikachu is just a terribly overrated pokemon.

Also, you need to drop that sense of unwarranted self importance you have around you. Neither me nor ToL were refering to your post about pikachu, I was refering to sonictheheadhogfan's post about how pikachu isn't overrated and how he has an awesome level 100 pikachu. I only noticed your post after reading your responce to me.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but the post that you made was about how pikachu IS overrated, and how it's lacking stat wise, which is what we both said. Funny how fast you not only contradict yourself, but you start to blab on about a bunch of other pokemon that have nothing to do with pikachu and his usefulness.

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Last edited by Face on Tue Dec 23, 2008 2:41 am, edited 1 time in total.



Tue Dec 23, 2008 2:25 am
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Sonicthehedgehogfan wrote:
I owned many people before with Pikachu.
My team is made out of
Pikachu
Infernape
Shaymin (legit)
Espone
Ralts
Pichu.
I've beat team full of Mewtwos even though non of my pokes have a dark type move.


Unless your opponent was stuck on stupid, I highly doubt this team killed anyone with half a sense of how the game works. Seriously, ralts and pichu?

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Tue Dec 23, 2008 2:31 am
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Face wrote:
Secondly, lets take a look at mr pikachus defense, hp and speed. Regardless of how much damage he could actually pull off, he is pathetically slow and frail, and pretty much any sweeper with decent speed will tear him down before he has a chance.

Lets look at Medicham for instance. It's max attack is only 240, but pure power makes it 480, which makes him capable of dealing massive damage. However, his speed, hp, and defenses are poor, and he can easily be taken down with just a bit of effort. Of course, if used right he can be a menace, but anyone who knows what they're doing can finish him off pretty quickly.

Any good sweeper needs speed or bulkiness, and pikachu just doesn't have either. I don't care how well Nidoking, Lickilicky, or any of those UUs you named do, pikachu is just a terribly overrated pokemon.


What makes Pikachu overrated by being one of the best unevolved Pokemon in the game? It's an Underused Pokemon and it has just enough speed (with a +Spd nature) to pull such a role off. Base 90 is actually NOT that slow in the usual environments that Pikachu would be found in: UU or Little Cup. In those environments, Pikachu is akin to the UU/LC version of Deoxys-A because it is relatively fast and can lay down a beating fairly quickly.

Anybody who is sane (i.e., anybody who actually counts to this discussion) knows that Pikachu isn't that good competitively, even though Light Ball means that it IS usable in UU. Pikachu is overrated by little kids, whose opinions don't mean much in the first place anyway because they don't know the intricacies of the game, but it's neither underrated nor overrated by competitive battlers who actually know what they are doing.

I'm also not sure what your point was regarding Medicham. How exactly is it easy to take down with a little effort if it's holding a Choice Scarf, gets to move first and it steamrolls its current opponent? Yeah, it has the defenses of glass, but it's not exactly easy to get a counter in against something with Medicham's pure power without it getting plowed on the switch-in.

Lickilicky was only brought up as an example to show that doubling base stats isn't the correct way to handle stat boosts caused by items/stat modifiers, because you did say that Pikachu had base 110 Attack after Light Ball, and that isn't how Light Ball works.


Tue Dec 23, 2008 5:18 am
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Face wrote:
Also, you need to drop that sense of unwarranted self importance you have around you. Neither me nor ToL were refering to your post about pikachu, I was refering to sonictheheadhogfan's post about how pikachu isn't overrated and how he has an awesome level 100 pikachu. I only noticed your post after reading your responce to me.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but the post that you made was about how pikachu IS overrated, and how it's lacking stat wise, which is what we both said. Funny how fast you not only contradict yourself, but you start to blab on about a bunch of other pokemon that have nothing to do with pikachu and his usefulness.


Well, OK. Sorry if I upset you with this sense of importance. I do need to work on my altitude a little.

But what I was saying was that Pikachu is overrated, but not THAT overrated.

Back to the topic of Sonicthehedgehogfan, nobody who plays ubers EVER uses full teams of Mewtwos. It's too frail to survive a Pokémon faster than it (i.e. Deoxys-F) and can only OHKO most defensive ubers after a bunch of Calm Minds/Charge Beams. Therefore, the person that sonicthehedgehogfan battled probably wasn't in their right mind. Or just wasn't good at Pokémon.

By the way, Face, do remind me if I'm accidentally keeping up this `sense of importance`. I do apologise if I do. This `sense of importance` must be making my reputation bad.

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Wed Dec 24, 2008 2:50 am
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Frost wrote:


What makes Pikachu overrated by being one of the best unevolved Pokemon in the game? It's an Underused Pokemon and it has just enough speed (with a +Spd nature) to pull such a role off. Base 90 is actually NOT that slow in the usual environments that Pikachu would be found in: UU or Little Cup. In those environments, Pikachu is akin to the UU/LC version of Deoxys-A because it is relatively fast and can lay down a beating fairly quickly.

Anybody who is sane (i.e., anybody who actually counts to this discussion) knows that Pikachu isn't that good competitively, even though Light Ball means that it IS usable in UU. Pikachu is overrated by little kids, whose opinions don't mean much in the first place anyway because they don't know the intricacies of the game, but it's neither underrated nor overrated by competitive battlers who actually know what they are doing.


I wasn't talking about pikachu's overrated status as far as competative battling goes. The original post I replied to stated that pikachu was not overrated. As far as pokemon as a whole goes, pikachu is the perfect example of what an overrated pokemon is. People that don't know a damn about pokemon still know pikachu. Many, many people love pikachu, regardless of how into the game/series they are. Pikachu is the only anime/game character you will ever see on the T-shirts, pillows, blankets, etc., of people who don't, nor ever have, played or watched pokemon. Well, the only character besides Goku, but that has nothing to do with this.

About the little kids comment, they are the same fans who make pokemon like Lucario and Mewtwo overrated as well, to name a few. So as far as calling something overrated goes, little kids opinions count just as much. Ever hear of Hannah Montana? Or maybe The Jonas Brothers? They are both insanely overrated, and little kids are to thank for that as well.

As for competative battling, I was refering to sonicfans statement that his pikachu had awesome stats. Sure, maybe he's good for his metagame, but sonicfan never refered to the metagames, he simply refered to his pikachu as awesome, which as far as every other pokemon is concerned, there isn't really anything ''awesome'' about him. Sure, he's the best unevolved pokemon there is, but that's not worth a damn thing compared to most, if not all, evolved pokemon.

Frost wrote:
I'm also not sure what your point was regarding Medicham. How exactly is it easy to take down with a little effort if it's holding a Choice Scarf, gets to move first and it steamrolls its current opponent? Yeah, it has the defenses of glass, but it's not exactly easy to get a counter in against something with Medicham's pure power without it getting plowed on the switch-in.


I now realise the way I worded it was a bad choice, however, medicham is still a great example. Medicham needs that item slot for Choice Scarf, or else his speed really hurts him. Pikachu is forced to use a light ball, which means his speed is still going to be crap. And his defenses aren't helping that at all. Maybe pikachu stands well in UU, but for the game as a whole, Pikachu is crap.

Frost wrote:
Lickilicky was only brought up as an example to show that doubling base stats isn't the correct way to handle stat boosts caused by items/stat modifiers, because you did say that Pikachu had base 110 Attack after Light Ball, and that isn't how Light Ball works.


Yeah, what I said about his base stat was a mistake, a pretty big one at that. However, I wasn't nessicarily refering to Lickilicky when I said about him blabbing on about UU. I was refering to the other names he dropped, like Nidoking and the like. Mentioning how he can beat OU pokemon with UU pokemon really has nothing to do with pikachus power. At all.

And since apperantly, no one seems to get it, I am NOT using pikachus ability in the metagame to describe his popularity as over/underrated. I was only mentioning his stats and usefulness to prove my point to sonicfan. Pikachu may be cute and cuddly and a decent UU, but he is not, by any means, awesome when it comes to battling as a whole.

I said it once, and I will say it again. The ONLY way you will EVER see a pikachu that deserves the title of "Awesome" when it comes to his stats as a whole is if he was hacked.

Or maybe if he was parented by a acreus/pikachu inter-species couple that successfully reproduced?

~ Face

P.S. Sorry if some of that sounded like babbling, I'm pretty tired as of now. However, I think you all get what I'm trying to say, or at least I hope so.

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Fri Dec 26, 2008 11:33 pm
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Is it just me, or does Face seem angry? jk :P

Anyway, the Fighting-type is overrated.

OK, I know what you are thinking now (no i dont, but i sort of do).

How is Machamp overrated? How is Medicham overrated? How are all the other strong fighting-types overrated?

Here's the answer.

When I say that the fighting-type is overrated, I mean the fighting-type itself, as a type, not the Pokémon that are fighting type. Don't know anybody that overrates fighting-type? Here're the facts:

Many people like fighting-type moves on their Pokémon because of the awesome coverage they have. Fighting itself is super-effective on five different types: Normal, Rock, Steel, Ice and Dark. They can also cover every single Pokémon when you have a Ghost or Dragon type move with it. So therefore you could have a Salamence with Brick Break and Dragon Claw that can do at least neutral damage to every single Pokémon. Or maybe you could have a Lucario with Shadow Ball and Aura Sphere. So the fighting-type deals incredible coverage onto other Pokémon.

ORLY? Let's talk about the physical moves first. Whilst Fighting-type does deal incredible coverage, it also has its downsides. A large percentage of commonly-used Normal, Rock, Steel, Ice and Dark types all have very high HP and/or Defense. Just to name a few: Snorlax, Blissey, Tyranitar, Mamoswine, Rhyperior, Forretress, Metagross, Bronzong and Skarmory. An Adamant-natured Garchomp with full EVs and IVs in Attack can't OHKO Blissey, Snorlax, Tyranitar, Mamoswine or Rhyperior with Brick Break, without first getting in a Swords Dance. And by the time it gets in a Swords Dance, Mamoswine would already have either knocked out a lot of Garchomp's health with Ice Fang, or set up a Subsitute. Either way, it then finishes off with Ice Shard.

And besides, how many decent physical fighting-type moves are there? Brick Break, Close Combat, Cross Chop, and what else? Besides, the only commonly-used Pokémon that uses Cross Chop is Electivire, and Close Combat is only utilised by Infernape, Lucario and Gallade, all of which are Life Orb users which get knocked out by priorities anyway. Brick Break is the other good physical-fighting move; A max-attack Garchomp can't even knock out a max-HP Tyranitar with Brick Break. One Swords Dance later, Tyranitar would have used Dragon Dance (probably), and then, with a Jolly-nature, it would outspeed a max-speed Garchomp and knock it over the horizon with Ice Punch. And that's even with a Garchomp with both max-attack and max-speed; in real-life, it can only max out one stat. And before you start moaning about Garchomp being uber, I WAS USING GARCHOMP AS AN EXAMPLE.

Let's move on to the special fighting-moves, shall we? I will now admit that special moves (i.e. Aura Sphere and Focus Blast, the latter of which is hardly ever used and misses a lot anyway) are better off than physicals, because now Rhyperior and Mamoswine are doomed, but that's it. Tyranitar has Sand Stream, giving it a special defense higher than Deoxys-L's, and Aura Sphere's not doing much if Brick Break isn't. And anyway, there are only two-fighting-type moves that are commonly used: Aura Sphere and Focus Blast. Aura Sphere is only ever used by Lucario in OU, and Focus Blast is only used by Gengar, Infernape and Magmortar (the latter isn't used much, anyway). Focus Blast's accuracy was what caused me to once set up three Dragon Dances from a Tyranitar while fighting a Gengar and sweeping the rest of the team.

So there we are. Fighting-types are overrated.

P.S. I can agree with an overrated Lucario, but Mewtwo isn't far from what people view it as.

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Sat Dec 27, 2008 6:47 am
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I think that the three legendary birds are overrated because even though people dont use them much, they say i caught the 3 birds.Unless going for a mixed type double battle team they are not what people say they are

I confused myself :frustrated: :frustrated:


Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:36 am
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