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Venumeleon
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 11:31 pm Posts: 139
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I've been looking at Meganium as a possible defensive wall. Its defenses are both good save a rather average HP and being a starter it doesn't have any really bad stats.
@Leftovers
Calm/Bold
252HP, 252SDef, 6Def
Leech Seed
Substitute
Aromatherapy/Synthesis
Counter/Energy Ball/Earthquake
Meganium really needs a better offensive movepool in my opinion- it doesn't really have much to counter Flyers except Return and Counter. It's a basic Subseeding set, with Aroma to cure your team's statuses, or Synthesis to heal. The last move is a bit undecided- Counter shuts out Heracross, Flyers, and Drapion, Energy Ball gets STAB, and EQ takes out Fires and Steels.
Thoughts? Comments?
_________________ <center><img src="images/trainercards/Venumeleon.png"></center>
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Sun Feb 10, 2008 8:22 pm |
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Sapphirath
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:25 am Posts: 627 Location: Singapore
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If you're looking for a wall there're plenty of better ones out there...and I don't really think Meganium is good at KOing other Pokemon at all so if I were you I would go for the pure support build:
Nature: Calm/Bold
EVs: 252 HP, 126 Def, 126 Sp. Def
Item: Light Clay
Moves:
~Reflect
~Light Screen
~Aromatherapy/Counter
~Synthesis
Of course, you'll have to worry about Pokemon with Brick Break but not many have that move so you should be quite safe.
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Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:57 am |
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4ever_bug_catcher
Ace Trainer
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:14 pm Posts: 306 Location: lawl.
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Actually, if you have Counter, it would be a not-so-pleasant surprise to those trying to break your walls via Brick Break.
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Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:18 pm |
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Sapphirath
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:25 am Posts: 627 Location: Singapore
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Brick Break is something to fear because Meganium won't be supporting much then.
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Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:05 am |
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Sword of Destiny
Psychic Trainer
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:01 pm Posts: 67 Location: Lost in the chaos
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How about this one?
@ Leftovers
Bold - Overgrow
252 HP, 129 Def, 129 SpDef
~ Leech Seed
~ Protect/Toxic/Substitute
~ Safeguard/Grass Knot/Energy Ball
~ HP Fire
Meganium can get really annoying with Leftovers + Leech Seed. Protect to get a free turn to heal, Toxic for wearing foes down faster or Substitute for blocking damage and status conditions. Safeguard to avoid status conditions that will wear meganium down or Grass Knot/Energy Ball for dealing more damage and getting some type coverage. HP Fire to punish grass types who switch into meganium to avoid leech seed. Obviously, if you pick Substitute for the second slot, don't go with Safeguard; choose one of the other moves instead.
It does not have a way to deal with fire types but meganiums should just switch out anyway if they come across any of them.
Don't expect it to work into standard play but it might be good for UU or NU.
BTW Sapphirath, you messed up your EV spread. It should be: 252 HP, 129 Def, 129 SpDef
Last edited by Sword of Destiny on Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:48 am |
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Sapphirath
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:25 am Posts: 627 Location: Singapore
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3 EVs don't make a Difference. So I usualy stop EV training there.
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Wed Feb 13, 2008 3:03 am |
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The Obsidian Wolf
Pokemon Master
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2006 12:03 am Posts: 1559 Location: Dragon's Den
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Sword of Destiny wrote: How about this one?
@ Leftovers
Bold - Overgrow
252 HP, 129 Def, 129 SpDef
~ Leech Seed
~ Ingrain
~ Safeguard
~ HP Fire
Meganium can get really annoying with Leftovers + Ingrain + Leech Seed. Safeguard to avoid status conditions that will wear meganium down. HP Fire to punish grass types who switch into meganium to avoid leech seed. It does not have a way to deal with fire types but meganiums should just switch out anyway if they come across any of them.
Don't expect it to work into standard play but it might be good for UU or NU.
BTW Sapphirath, you messed up your EV spread. It should be: 252 HP, 129 Def, 129 SpDef
Yes, because 129 is divisible by four.
I think Meganium is an interesting Pokemon, not least because of its lack of poison dual type. I'd go with some kind of Sub Seeding set, as Sub acts as a sort of Safeguard.
Also, Meganium isn't that defensive that it's able to use Ingrain. If something comes in that'll OHKO it (Infernape / Blaziken / Anything with a stab s/e move?) then it's going to hurt, and Meggy won't be able to do a thing about it.
THe other thing is, if you want a Sub Seeder, go with Sceptile; faster and has better attacks. However, most people train Pokemon because they like them, as opposed to their stats, but it's all up to preference.
_________________"Play with fire and expect to be burned."
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Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:36 am |
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Sword of Destiny
Psychic Trainer
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:01 pm Posts: 67 Location: Lost in the chaos
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First of all:
126 EVs = 31 points
129 EVs = 32 points
The Obsidian Wolf wrote: Also, Meganium isn't that defensive that it's able to use Ingrain. If something comes in that'll OHKO it (Infernape / Blaziken / Anything with a stab s/e move?) then it's going to hurt, and Meggy won't be able to do a thing about it.
As i stated above, Meganium should only be used in UU and NU. It's one of the worst starters and it just doesn't have the stats to compete with other pokemon in OU or even BL.
Meganium will be OHKOed if it is hit with a stabbed fire attack coming from a respectable attack stat but again, as i stated above, it should switch out anyway.
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Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:02 am |
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The Obsidian Wolf
Pokemon Master
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2006 12:03 am Posts: 1559 Location: Dragon's Den
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Sword of Destiny wrote: First of all:
126 EVs = 31 points
129 EVs = 32 points
So why list it as 129? Surely the stat is 128? And besides, it was supposed to be amusing, not a stab at your mathmatical skill. =/
Quote:
The Obsidian Wolf wrote: Also, Meganium isn't that defensive that it's able to use Ingrain. If something comes in that'll OHKO it (Infernape / Blaziken / Anything with a stab s/e move?) then it's going to hurt, and Meggy won't be able to do a thing about it.
Meganium will be OHKOed if it is hit with a stabbed fire attack coming from a respectable attack stat but again, as i stated above, it should switch out anyway.
...
Quote: How about this one?
@ Leftovers
Bold - Overgrow
252 HP, 129 Def, 129 SpDef
~ Leech Seed
~ Ingrain
~ Safeguard
~ HP Fire
Quote: as i stated above, it should switch out anyway.
Yes, good luck switching out after using Ingrain.
_________________"Play with fire and expect to be burned."
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Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:10 am |
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Sword of Destiny
Psychic Trainer
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:01 pm Posts: 67 Location: Lost in the chaos
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Oh sorry... I forgot about Ingrain's side effect... LOL at me
Anyway, you can replace Ingrain with:
- Protect to get a free turn to heal using lefties and leech seed if the opponent doesn't switch
- Toxic for wearing foes down faster
- And Substitute for blocking damage and status conditions. If you use sub then safeguard is useless, so you can replace that as well with Grass Knot or Energy Ball.
BTW i'll edit my post.
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Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:27 am |
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Sapphirath
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:25 am Posts: 627 Location: Singapore
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Since when was 129 divisible by 4 and errr...I thought 4 EVs increase a stat by one and anything less gains your Pokemon nothing? Anyway I guess I did mess up but in a Different way...it should be 126 EVs in Def and 132 in Sp. Def (This way Sp. Def is further increased by 1) . Not 126 in both and 129 EVs in both stats makes no difference with 126 in both.
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Thu Feb 14, 2008 2:07 am |
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4ever_bug_catcher
Ace Trainer
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:14 pm Posts: 306 Location: lawl.
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Actually, if you increase the EVs from 126 to 132 EVs, you would gain 2 stat points. Although 129 isn't divisible by 4, neither is 126 too.
129EVs in both stats increase both stats by 1 point [from 126EVs] because, again, you reach 128EVs, giving you that stat point. In this context, Meganium will still get owned by flamethrowers, ice beams and the like, so it doesn't really matter, but it's here just to throw some math around.
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Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:16 pm |
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Sapphirath
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:25 am Posts: 627 Location: Singapore
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Don't blame me cos I failed my Math...anyway if that's the case then I guess 128 in both Sp. Def and Def should be the correct spread. A little Sp. Def, Def, Hp and Reflect or Light Screen and Synthesis will help it survive long enough to do it's job.
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Fri Feb 15, 2008 8:40 pm |
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Roar Of Time
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 5:25 am Posts: 691
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Quote: Meganium @ Leftovers
Bold - Overgrow
252 HP, 129 Def, 129 SpDef
~ Leech Seed
~ Ingrain
~ Safeguard
~ HP Fire
Might be better as....
Meganium @ Leftovers
Bold - Overgrow
252 HP, 100 Def, 129 SpDef, 29 SP ATK
~ Leech Seed
~ Ingrain Aromatherapy
~ Safeguard
~ HP Fire
29 SP ATK to give a small boost to Hidden Power, Bold already boosts DEF, so both defenses are the same. Aromatherapy to give team support.
_________________Clickage <Derek> is anyone here ?? <AngrySparrow> No <Derek> im gonna leave because no one is here *** Derek has quit (Exit: Psypoke Forever!)
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Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:51 am |
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Sword of Destiny
Psychic Trainer
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:01 pm Posts: 67 Location: Lost in the chaos
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Roar Of Time wrote: Might be better as....
Meganium @ Leftovers
Bold - Overgrow
252 HP, 100 Def, 129 SpDef, 29 SP ATK
~ Leech Seed
~ Ingrain Aromatherapy
~ Safeguard
~ HP Fire
29 SP ATK to give a small boost to Hidden Power, Bold already boosts DEF, so both defenses are the same. Aromatherapy to give team support.
Umm... Why would you want Aromatherapy since you have Safeguard?
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Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:56 am |
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Roar Of Time
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 5:25 am Posts: 691
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Oh lol @ me, How about....Counter?
_________________Clickage <Derek> is anyone here ?? <AngrySparrow> No <Derek> im gonna leave because no one is here *** Derek has quit (Exit: Psypoke Forever!)
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Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:02 pm |
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