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 Rock Polish Rampardos Sweeper 
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Psychic Trainer
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Would it be viable in OU?

Rampardos

Adamant @ Focus Sash

Rock Polish
EQ
Zen Headbutt?
Rock slide or stone edge?

I really am lost for a decent moveset. perhaps brick break instead of zen headbutt. I think it could work, cuz u would focus sash and then be fast enough to sweep. PLUS, sandstorm would only help you, meaning they would have to e-speed or something to take this thing down. just a thought.

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Tue Oct 02, 2007 5:34 pm
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I heard this was a good moveset, dunno if it's true or not:

Head Smash
Brick Break
Earthquake or Stone Edge
Zen Headbutt

Personally i think Head Smash would be good. especially if you could baton pass a ninjask before hand with loads of speed, that would be a good thing IMO.

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Tue Oct 02, 2007 5:40 pm
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so you're suggesting a bped agility from ninjask and choice scarfing it, right? i thought about this but the problem is, I dont want to rely on ninjask, and if he gets countered somehow then im screwed. (i just dont like relying on bpers in general). i need rock polish for this to work alone, and that means i need focus sash. head smash would recoil and kill rampardos on 1 hp, so i cant use that.


Edit: GRRR. I always mix up CB with Choice Scarf. I meant to say you're thinking of Choice Banding it. that would make more sense with a bped agility

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Last edited by yanmafan on Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Tue Oct 02, 2007 5:53 pm
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i understand what you're saying, but if he was at 1 hp he could still dish out some massive damage with head smash.

I do understand what you're saying tho. i've been wondering about a good moveset for rampardos myself actually. :D

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Tue Oct 02, 2007 5:57 pm
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@Focus Sash
Earthquake
Stone Edge
Rock Polish
Crunch

I wouldn't advise Zen Headbutt, but it's an option if you are worried about Heracross or Breloom.

Another option:

@Salac Berry
Endure
Earthquake
Stone Edge
Crunch/Endeavor

Almost the same results as above, but might work better in different situations.

Other than that, try it with Trick Room. As a stand alone Pokemon it just isn't very effective, it needs some kind of support for its Speed stat.


Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:40 pm
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salac berry doesnt give as big of a boost as focus sash though, so its definately not as good in this situation, since i need a rather large boost. 1.5 would still leave me slower than a lot of sweepers. Rampardos wouldnt survive long enough to use endeavor. plus he's strong enough to ohko anyway, so there's no need. crunch seems viable though. its between that, brick break, or zen.

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Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:49 pm
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Crunch is by far more viable than either. Easily takes down Starmie, Alakazam, Gengar, and hits Dusknoir hard.

Really, Trick Room is the best strategy. Rampardos can't take a single hit (although with Sash it takes two) and is initially too slow, so finding an opening for Rock Polish will be too hard, and even if you get it off once some Pokemon will still outrun you. You can survive the first hit and use RP, but then something faster can still come out and finish you off. And then there's anything Quick Attack/Ice Shard/etc.

Granted that switching into something after Trick Room is activated won't be easy either, but it's still probably a better chance than RP.


Tue Oct 02, 2007 7:03 pm
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agreed on crunch then. but still, pretty much the only pokemon that could outspeed a max ev'd speed Rampardos with a RP would be Choice Sasher's.

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Tue Oct 02, 2007 7:22 pm
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yanmafan wrote:
agreed on crunch then. but still, pretty much the only pokemon that could outspeed a max ev'd speed Rampardos with a RP would be Choice Sasher's.


Choice Scarfers are common, so being outrun is going to be a very real threat.

Firstly, you're assuming you have max speed IVs, and you had better if you want to make this useable for OU, otherwise you'll get outrun.

Secondly, Spikes and Stealth Rock ruin the Focus Sash idea since it only works at full HP. You absolutely MUST eliminate their Spikes before bringing Rampardos around or Focus Sash is useless. So by running this set you now have a Pokemon who cannot see any play until you have KO'd their Spikers AND used Rapid Spin to clear the field. Since Spikes are so popular on so many teams if you don't have Rapid Spin you face a serious risk.

Set up moves on Rampardos simply do not favor him, unless it is very late game and your opponent is down to mostly his utility Pokemon or he is stupid and doesn't go on the offense as soon as he sees Rampardos come into play.

Not only that, you've basically shot down all the helpful ideas we've given you, such as BPing Agility and Trick Room, because you want a stand alone Pokemon. Any experienced player will tell you that some Pokemon simply cannot function to their full potential without relying on support from the rest of the team. In fact, you should never look at one Pokemon of your team as if it were separate, all 6 must work in harmony. If you want to use that set then fine, play it. If you want to win in an OU environment though, then don't use it.


Tue Oct 02, 2007 9:31 pm
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thanks for the input case. the reason ive shot ideas down is because i cant afford to put a bper on the team ive made up. i think I'll drop Rampardos altogether.

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Wed Oct 03, 2007 5:40 am
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If you want to use Rampa, you MUST, MUST, MUST and MUST pair it with a PassJask.

Ninjask with Substitute/Protect/Baton Pass/X-Scissor @Leftovers.

Jask protects on ze first turn, sub on the second, protect on the third, sub on the next, then protect again in the fifth turn before finally BPing the +5 speed to Rampa.

Rampa @ Life Orb with Head Smash/Earthquake/Crunch/Brick Break.

Rampa is a glass cannon anyways, and if it gets a hit its pretty much an OHKO so it will not be badly effected from Life Orb recoil.

But if you let Jask pass speed to this guy, it's gg. A Life Orb STAB Head Smash from a +570 attack is nothing to laugh at. +5 speed will makes it impossible getting overrun.

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Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:00 am
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Do Not listen to Gnaaye, I'm almost ready to say Ever.

Ninjask/rampardos does not work if you're playing any sort of OU/Serious team. The difficult trick of powering up and getting a turn is not easy, but there's a few ways. Ninjask isn't Nearly as good as anyone thinks. It's like almost automatically dead.

You can scare the enemy pokemon, Perhaps a weezing would retreat, but in that situation it's probably just better to attack, maybe even choice band style.

You can Sub, which is one I like to do to scan for other attacks. The sub can work in conjunction with an item like lum berry to switch in on status inflicters, or if something like that kills a pokemon of your you can switch it in and sub. The sub blocks status and even mean look. If they switch to something you have a sub to give you options.

Attack/rockpolish/switch. It's all really tough but he get's pretty fast and strong.

The Serious issue is that most dragon dancers have higher attack then him and some are even faster.

Really if there was something you'd need it'd be a sandstream team. That could have speed/attack passing, and special def boosting and all kinds of crap around.

It's never a safe option, but people never pick rampardos to be safe anyway.


Fri Oct 05, 2007 3:04 am
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FaceLess wrote:
Do Not listen to Gnaaye, I'm almost ready to say Ever.


Do listen to Gnaaye. He's excellent at this sort of stuff.

Quote:

Ninjask/rampardos does not work if you're playing any sort of OU/Serious team. The difficult trick of powering up and getting a turn is not easy, but there's a few ways. Ninjask isn't Nearly as good as anyone thinks. It's like almost automatically dead.


...really, this just screams failure. JaskLead is excellent, passing masses of stats onto other Pokemon.

Quote:

You can Sub, which is one I like to do to scan for other attacks. The sub can work in conjunction with an item like lum berry to switch in on status inflicters, or if something like that kills a pokemon of your you can switch it in and sub. The sub blocks status and even mean look. If they switch to something you have a sub to give you options.


Ramp isn't going to be fast enough to pull of a sub. Hence Ninjask, which you deem a failure.

Quote:

Attack/rockpolish/switch. It's all really tough but he get's pretty fast and strong.

The Serious issue is that most dragon dancers have higher attack then him and some are even faster.


...Have you actually checked Ramp's base attack?The above statement suggests not.
Quote:

Really if there was something you'd need it'd be a sandstream team. That could have speed/attack passing, and special def boosting and all kinds of crap around.

It's never a safe option, but people never pick rampardos to be safe anyway.


There isn't a 'totally safe' Pokemon ever. That's why the game isn't broken and so successful.

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Fri Oct 05, 2007 5:23 am
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The Obsidian Wolf wrote:
FaceLess wrote:
Do Not listen to Gnaaye, I'm almost ready to say Ever.

Do listen to Gnaaye. He's excellent at this sort of stuff.

I love you, Obs.

Seriously Faceless, why are you flaming me all around the place? You did this at the Weavile thread too, why?


Mr.-I-R-Best-At-Everything wrote:
The Serious issue is that most dragon dancers have higher attack then him and some are even faster
Fail. Just fail. Nearly everything outspeeds and OHKO's Rampa, that was why I said pair it with a JaskPass. The ONLY things that can counter the strategy I mentioned are psuedo/hazers and if someone switchs in one just try to abuse Protect hax + XScizzor ftw.

And Rampa has the best non-uber attack. It's attack stat is a rival to Deoxys-FR's.

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Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:44 am
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The Obsidian Wolf wrote:
A whole lot of stuff that'd make this reply too big.
Jask lead is Not OU if you'll check the lists, it's prmarily because Gyrados, and Skarmory and Weavile three of the most OU pokemon in this gen all beat it head to head, and you can even switch in skarmory to beat it.

Stealth rocks also take 50% health from it, it's only gotten weaker in this gen and it was never very successful in the previous gen. I've played against tons of guys who thought ninjask was a great lead and it never worked out for them.

When I said dragon dancers have higher attack, I meant it. After one dragon dance they usually hit around 600 attack, if the dragon dancer is Salamence, then it's faster and stronger than rampardos after a rock polish. With the exception of bulky gyrados which has other awesome properties.

No amount of x-scissor/protect hax beats skarm or gyrados, and weavile is a case by case basis since it's going to be trying to ice shard you. Other pokemon like Scizor can work similar moves, Or heck now that I think about it Hippowdon beats it too with roar, or ice fang/stone edge if it's running sash.

Subbing doesn't require speed, it just requires you cause a switch, or otherwise cause an opponent move to not damage you that turn, and I do admit Rampardos isn't the best at the whole thing. but Really it'd be a complete was if he was faster and was subbing because the subs would be destroyed and he'd get nothing out of it. So I have no idea what that argument is about.

Ninjask is still a failure, look around he's not OU, and he has more counters now than ever and the counters Are OU.

And we agree on the last note, which means I don't have to say anything about it.

Gnaaye, I apologize for the weavile thread, it was the straw that broke the camel's back.

You see for a while I'd been correcting your advice in a lot of your rates. I'm not the only one who's realized that your rates have a high level of mistakes. A lot of them. And I got Very angry when someone who had a better set than you was getting lip from you. Because, even though you're good for your age, You're not great. You're still learning, we all are, and I don't mind you helping people you can help.

But a lot of these people you have no place rating. a lot of your advice you have no place giving. Because you just aren't far enough yourself to help everyone that you try to help.

BTW everyone, I've seen someone try this rampardos/jask combo, and it failed. Every time. Both pokemon became dead weight on the team. Because it's too easy to counter. Maybe if you play Borderline/Underused you can get a higher success rate if you find a place considering Ramp borderline, but in OU It's basically sacrificing 2 pokemon to run that.

2 OU pokemon that I use are effective jask counters, and I'm breeding a different OU pokemon right now that's a jask counter. Not because they counter jask, but because they are versatile and strong, jask just can't handle OU. Taunt, roar, whirlwind, priority moves, sandstream. Pretty darn common in the competitive metagame, and they will mess ninjask up.

Not that I think about it, Gyroball beats this combo too.


Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:37 pm
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Wow what a long post...

Ninjask has been downgraded this generation by stealth rock, Skarmory with (whirlwind) and Tauntdros because of the simple fact that its obvious Ninjask will be the opener of a battle....

Competitive battlers aren't that stupid to let a Ninjask do all of its tricks no... There's something called counters and that means this ruins the whole Jask/Rampardos duo.

Faceless has explained everything that I would have said but in a (shorter version.)

Thank you for this discussion
:wink:

- Chris

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Sat Oct 06, 2007 10:16 am
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Well of course there's counters to anything....but I guess it could work.


Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:49 pm
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ninjask is good for one thing in my opinion. and that is setting up an easy win against someone who doesnt know much about battle strategy. so if youre battling an inexperienced trainer, then ninjask + rampardos would go over really well. you'll probably OHKO their entire team. but against more serious opponents their lead will just kill a couple of your subs and just when you think youre getting somewhere, they switch in skarmory and blow you away. stealth rock will come up before jask can come back, and its effectively dead. a better bet by far is to bring rampardos in and force a switch, giving you a free hit after which you will probably need to switch out yourself. its a pity its not a ground type, otherwise you could switch it in on a predicted thunderwave. if you think you can predict really well, then you could add substitute which you could use on a predicted switch, but then you really just get one turn to hit the next opponent before your sub breaks and you have to switch anyway. unless you have rock polish as well, but then you only have two attacks on a very strong physical attacker, which doesnt seem right to me. in my opinion rampardos is basically a fragile, slow slaking who doesnt have to miss every second turn (they have the same base attack if im not mistaken). but slaking usually does a hit and run anyway, so i guess its just up to you.

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Wed Oct 10, 2007 5:22 pm
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I'm sorry, but FaceLess wins. You guys obviously haven't seen the many counters to Ninjask and how fragile it is in a team. Scizor is a more viable Baton Passer than that disgusting piece of rubbish, as it is sturdy and only has one weakness (which ISN'T Stealth Rock, Ice Shard Weavile, Gyro Ball, etc.).

EDIT: Oh hai, I forgotted to mention Taunt, Roar, Whirlwind, Haze, and Bulky Gyarados in general.

BUT more on-topic:

You COULD do a Rampardos version of Agiligross.

Rampardos @ Focus Sash/Leftovers
Adamant | Mold Breaker
252 Atk, 200 Spd, 58 HP
Rock Polish
Earthquake
Stone Edge
Crunch

This is like an Agiligross set because with 31 IVs in all of the designated stats and the above spread, you'll get 202 speed. After one Rock Polish, you'll outspeed Jolly Weavile, and Jolteon/Aerodactyl and friends, as well as Choice Scarfers with 269 speed or higher (cough, Heracross). You don't need to waste the other 52 EVs in speed, so you can put it into HP along with the remaining 6 EVs (if you're interested in an effort ribbon).

The problem with this set is that Metagross and Tyranitar do it 25610257 times better. They are much sturdier and much safer to switch in. The only thing Rampardos has on them is their attack, and 471 really is overkill in the end anyway.


Last edited by Taser on Thu Oct 11, 2007 6:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:52 pm
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Seriously, go run that combo around real competetive battlers, in a REAL battle forum, and see how far it gets you. I didn't combine Rampardos with Jask, because wasting 2 slots on mediocre pokemon hurts, but, I HAVE used Jask, and have fought Jask, and, believe me, he is not good anymore.

Weavile and Gyarados, who are both incredibly common starts, murder the ninja. Ice Shard or Taunt from Weavile ruins Jask, and, Taunt from Gyarados ruins it, giving both a free turn to use their Stat boosting moves (Swords Dance or Dragon Dance) while Ninja either switches or attempts to win with X-Scissor (Which, will indeed hurt Weavile, should it not have a Sash).

I, myself, have used a PassJask as a start, and, it fails at life, even with Protect. People just use the turns to switch in a Hazer/Phazer, or set up on you with better moves, like Dragon Dance or Swords Dance, or Agility, or set up Subs for Focus Punch, ect.

Not to mention, one of the most common moves in the game is Stealth Rock, and, once Jask passes, if the pass target fails quickly, Jask cannot do it again should it have subbed more than twice in the process.

If you are not prepared, then, yes, PassJask is good, but, due to it's popularity in the last generation, it is very much expected my most decent battlers. Taunt and Roar/Whirlwind, Moves like Ice Shard and Bullet Punch, are all rampant in the REAL OverUsed metagame. Jask dies to all of it.

I have nothing against anyone here, but, making statements without any facts is a no-no. kthnxbai.

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Thu Oct 11, 2007 6:10 pm
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