|
It is currently Mon Mar 18, 2024 6:01 pm
|
|
Page 1 of 1
|
[ 20 posts ] |
|
Steel type = overpowered.
Author |
Message |
Rowol
Pokemon Trainer
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2007 12:40 pm Posts: 28 Location: Ptop, AZ
|
I was looking over the types when I was trying to build my team and let me say, steel is ridiculously overpowered, and I dearly hope they nerf it in the next game. Look at Steel's attributes:
Resistances:
Normal
Grass
Ice
Flying
Psychic
Bug
Rock
Ghost
Dragon
Dark
Steel
Immunities:
Poison
Weaknesses:
Fire
Fighting
Ground
Weaknesses to steel:
Ice
Rock
Now the Steel type resists a total amount of 11 different pokemon types, with another 1 as an immunity. It has a total of 3 weaknesses and only 2 types do normal damage to a full steel pokemon. When you factor dual types like a steel/flying you remove 2 weaknesses, add 1 weakness, and add 1 normal damage type.
I realize that the steel type is considered more of a defensive type. But think about it, many types have just as many types weak against them as steel does. And easily only a quarter of the list of total types they are resistant to. Take Ice for example.
Resistances:
Ice
Weaknesses:
Rock
Steel
Fire
Fighting
Weaknesses to Ice:
Ground
Flying
Dragon
Grass
How on earth can steel resist 11 types, have an immunity to 1 type, and have a weakness to only 3 types, when Ice, has resistance to 1 type, a weakness to 4 types and no immunities? Its ridiculous.
And its just like that for many other types, such as flying and poison.
_________________New FC and name
|
Fri Oct 26, 2007 1:13 pm |
|
|
Groudon King
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:24 pm Posts: 521 Location: Cave of Origins, in the Depths of the Abyss
|
The term, steel is ridiculously overpowered, is ridiculously wrong. Even though Fire, Fighting, and Ground are its only weaknesses they are the most common types of moves used in battle. Now I few that a few types, (dragon, ghost, psychic, and dark) should not be a steel type resistance, but most of the others make sence. With Ice, well what else other than ice could it be resistant to?
_________________TRADE (Lv. 51 Palkia) Sig & TC by me
|
Fri Oct 26, 2007 1:42 pm |
|
|
Roar Of Time
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 5:25 am Posts: 691
|
I agree with Groudon King coz well a lot of steel types are almost never used eg- Wormadam. Only about 8 steel types are Borderline or above, the rest are UU or NU. This is one of the many reasons why steel types have lots of great immunties and a great resistance which stops them being 'intoxicated' by toxic.
_________________Clickage <Derek> is anyone here ?? <AngrySparrow> No <Derek> im gonna leave because no one is here *** Derek has quit (Exit: Psypoke Forever!)
|
Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:18 pm |
|
|
Rowol
Pokemon Trainer
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2007 12:40 pm Posts: 28 Location: Ptop, AZ
|
Quote: The term, steel is ridiculously overpowered, is ridiculously wrong. Even though Fire, Fighting, and Ground are its only weaknesses they are the most common types of moves used in battle. Now I few that a few types, (dragon, ghost, psychic, and dark) should not be a steel type resistance, but most of the others make sence. With Ice, well what else other than ice could it be resistant to?
I will give you that Ground is one of the most common move types used in battle. But I do not agree about fire and fighting. Fire is used only as often as water, and fire is only typically used because of.... tada! Steel types. Because quite honestly every team hold at least one steel type and possibly more. The other weak-to-fire types such as grass, bug and ice are not nearly as common. This is most likely because the number of useful bug/grass/ice types aren't as high as the steel types. And on top of that you haven't counted on dual types. Like I said, putting on a flying type removes steel's weakness to fighting and gives it a complete immunity to ground. The only bad side is putting electric on its weaknesses (which is only fairly common) and and ice on its normal damage.
As for fighting, one of the most common fighting moves is brick break, which is only typically used to deal with reflect / light screen. The other one I see most often is Close Combat. Other then that... what fighting moves would you say are part of the "most common types of moves used in battle?"
I don't know what moves Ice should be resistant to, but could we consider grass? dark? dragon? Dark is just thrown out there for the sake of having another type and I say dragon because since RBY versions the only weakness dragon had was to ice. Would it be an absolute impossibility to have it go both ways?
Quote: I agree with Groudon King coz well a lot of steel types are almost never used eg- Wormadam. Only about 8 steel types are Borderline or above, the rest are UU or NU. This is one of the many reasons why steel types have lots of great immunties and a great resistance which stops them being 'intoxicated' by toxic.
In response to Roar here, would you say that my example of ice or poison have MORE types then steel that are borderline or above? Because I sure don't think so. By your reckoning each of those should have a large number of resistances/whatever as well.
_________________New FC and name
|
Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:40 pm |
|
|
Groudon King
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:24 pm Posts: 521 Location: Cave of Origins, in the Depths of the Abyss
|
Your thinking more of types of Pokemon than the types of moves themselves. You could find a team with a Ground type attack but not have a Ground type Pokemon in the team. Out of Fighting type moves I'm pretty sure that there would be a lot of teams at have at least one Fighting type attack as well. I personaly like Aura Sphere, it may not be Close Combat strong, but it is kick butt none the less. I use a Fire type in every team, there arn't many Pokemon weak aganist them, but there arn't many strong either. Now the duel type thing doen't make a large difference either. Skarmory may not be weak to ground, but Electic type moves are common as well, and don't forget the new move Gravity that makes it weak to ground types.
Now to the ice type thing, with the relationship with Ice and Grass is like Electic and Water. The first may outdo the second, but the second works normaly aganist the first. I'll give you the dragon thing, but throwing Dark type in there for no real reason makes no sence.
_________________TRADE (Lv. 51 Palkia) Sig & TC by me
|
Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:24 pm |
|
|
Rowol
Pokemon Trainer
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2007 12:40 pm Posts: 28 Location: Ptop, AZ
|
Quote: Your thinking more of types of Pokemon than the types of moves themselves. You could find a team with a Ground type attack but not have a Ground type Pokemon in the team. Out of Fighting type moves I'm pretty sure that there would be a lot of teams at have at least one Fighting type attack as well. I personaly like Aura Sphere, it may not be Close Combat strong, but it is kick butt none the less. I use a Fire type in every team, there arn't many Pokemon weak aganist them, but there arn't many strong either. Now the duel type thing doen't make a large difference either. Skarmory may not be weak to ground, but Electic type moves are common as well, and don't forget the new move Gravity that makes it weak to ground types.
Well thats the whole point I'm trying to make is that the steel type is only weak to those types of moves. Almost every single team is going to include Earthquake, thats why I agreed with your ground type.
As for fighting, I understand why you like Aura sphere, seeing how you use a Lucario. But at the same time, Aura sphere is a very limited move (being only learn able by legendary pokemon, unless its Togekiss or Lucario.) But then again the biggest problem with Aura Sphere is that it is a special attack, and even if you are going to use it with a fighting pokemon, most of them don't hold a high spec attack, but rather a high attack stat. So really you do not see Aura sphere in normal OU and BR categories unless you are battling a Lucario. So I really cannot agree with your fighting type being an often used technique.
I also always include a fire type in all my teams (<3 Ninetales ^_^) But, the fire type is not nearly as common as some other types. (When you think about how every team will always have at LEAST 1 earthquake/ice beam and etc.) In fact I see a lot of teams that don't even have a flamethrower on the team, but rather leave the fire types to be beaten my ground or rock types.
Quote: Now to the ice type thing, with the relationship with Ice and Grass is like Electic and Water. The first may outdo the second, but the second works normaly aganist the first. I'll give you the dragon thing, but throwing Dark type in there for no real reason makes no sence.
I will admit that throwing in the dark thing doesn't make any sense. But does it make sense for Steel to be resistant to dark attacks? Or dragon for that matter? Or even ice?
And as for the grass, I think it does make sense for grass to be weak against Ice but I know why it isn't. Because grass is already weak against a large number of types anyway. BUT the point is, is that grass could/should be weak against ice. Its not the same as the electric water weakness, water conducts electricity (albeit somewhat poorly, but /shrug). But does electricity conduct water? Or do anything to it? No, not really. And I guess when I think about it like that, steel actually conducts electricity better then water in some cases... why isn't it weak against it?
Anyway, I was simply trying to point out that the ice type (along with other types) could use a boost, when you consider the amount of resistances steel has.
_________________New FC and name
|
Fri Oct 26, 2007 7:26 pm |
|
|
Groudon King
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:24 pm Posts: 521 Location: Cave of Origins, in the Depths of the Abyss
|
Quote: I will admit that throwing in the dark thing doesn't make any sense. But does it make sense for Steel to be resistant to dark attacks? Or dragon for that matter? Or even ice?
Did you forget this in my first post...
Quote: Now I few that a few types, (dragon, ghost, psychic, and dark) should not be a steel type resistance, but most of the others make sence.
Now steels resistance to ice makes sence. I mean in real life, throw ice cubes at a plate steel, it shouldn't really scratch it now.
I too enjoy using a fire type on the team. Wheather it be my Infernape, Roy, or my Charazard, Resembool. In my DX game I too use a Ninetales, named Sheena.
_________________TRADE (Lv. 51 Palkia) Sig & TC by me
|
Sat Oct 27, 2007 6:12 am |
|
|
Roar Of Time
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 5:25 am Posts: 691
|
Groudon King wrote:
Now steels resistance to ice makes sence. I mean in real life, throw ice cubes at a plate steel, it shouldn't really scratch it now.
I too enjoy using a fire type on the team. Wheather it be my Infernape, Roy, or my Charazard, Resembool. In my DX game I too use a Ninetales, named Sheena.
What groudon king said about ice and steel is true. Now the reason fire attacks work on steel is that is when steel is heated up it turns molten and essentialy it is in a liquid like state when heated up incredibily. So this why fire is supereffective on steel.
_________________Clickage <Derek> is anyone here ?? <AngrySparrow> No <Derek> im gonna leave because no one is here *** Derek has quit (Exit: Psypoke Forever!)
|
Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:20 am |
|
|
Rowol
Pokemon Trainer
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2007 12:40 pm Posts: 28 Location: Ptop, AZ
|
Quote: Did you forget this in my first post...
No I did not forget, I was reemphasizing what you said to prove my point.
Quote: Now steels resistance to ice makes sence. I mean in real life, throw ice cubes at a plate steel, it shouldn't really scratch it now.
I too enjoy using a fire type on the team. Wheather it be my Infernape, Roy, or my Charazard, Resembool. In my DX game I too use a Ninetales, named Sheena.
Well I agree if you threw ice cubes at a plate of steel it would not do anything. But if you lower the temperature of steel drastically (which I'm assuming an attack like "blizzard" would) The sheet of steel would become extremely brittle, and would break easily.
Quote: What groudon king said about ice and steel is true. Now the reason fire attacks work on steel is that is when steel is heated up it turns molten and essentialy it is in a liquid like state when heated up incredibily. So this why fire is supereffective on steel.
Who on earth asked why fire was super effective against steel?
_________________New FC and name
|
Sat Oct 27, 2007 10:09 am |
|
|
Groudon King
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:24 pm Posts: 521 Location: Cave of Origins, in the Depths of the Abyss
|
Quote: Well I agree if you threw ice cubes at a plate of steel it would not do anything. But if you lower the temperature of steel drastically (which I'm assuming an attack like "blizzard" would) The sheet of steel would become extremely brittle, and would break easily.
To get steel like that in real life, one would have to have a much larger drop in temperature than what you are thinking. The steel in question would have to be extremely hot to begin with then when the temp drops to freezing levels then it would be possible to do as you say, but in the Pokemon world battles have a normal temperature. Take a car for example, the exterier is metal plates and you can leave the car out in winter time without it breaking apart.
_________________TRADE (Lv. 51 Palkia) Sig & TC by me
|
Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:21 am |
|
|
Roman
Pokemon Trainer
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 6:39 pm Posts: 43
|
i agree, Steel-types do have a ton of resistances.
but that's just more incentive to put one on your team.
|
Sun Oct 28, 2007 9:58 am |
|
|
psynvrn
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:05 am Posts: 199 Location: Indonesia
|
But steel-type's biggest weakness is actually their speed. Lots of steel pokemon had a low speed.
_________________"Devotion, Determination, and Dedication is just what a leader requires." -psynvrn, 2008
|
Sun Oct 28, 2007 11:07 pm |
|
|
Mitch The Dragon Tamer
Ace Trainer
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 11:20 am Posts: 274
|
i agree steel Pokemon weknesses are few but if you think about its attacks that are very powerful already that are doubled on it such as fire blast and earthquake cause alot and rarly miss because of their low speed i think it makes it even ( as nearly every pkemon can learn a fire or ground move via tm)
additinal: Steal pokemon are very rarly pure stel and often have more than 4 weekness or cancle out one strenght
_________________ ERROR
|
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:52 am |
|
|
magikoopa
|
but also how many steel moves could a steel type actually learn the only 2 good ones are steel wing and gyro ball so steel i think is actually has to many weeeknesses
|
Sat Nov 03, 2007 9:26 am |
|
|
psynvrn
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:05 am Posts: 199 Location: Indonesia
|
magikoopa wrote: but also how many steel moves could a steel type actually learn the only 2 good ones are steel wing and gyro ball so steel i think is actually has to many weeeknesses
You forgot iron tail. And the weaknesses isn't that much.
_________________"Devotion, Determination, and Dedication is just what a leader requires." -psynvrn, 2008
|
Sun Nov 04, 2007 12:11 am |
|
|
Roar Of Time
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 5:25 am Posts: 691
|
That's true, but haven't you noticed there ain't a lot of steel types moves which allow you to attack, here's the short list:- Flash Cannon, Metal Claw, Gyro Bal and Iron Tail.
_________________Clickage <Derek> is anyone here ?? <AngrySparrow> No <Derek> im gonna leave because no one is here *** Derek has quit (Exit: Psypoke Forever!)
|
Sun Nov 04, 2007 4:18 am |
|
|
DNA
Trivia Champion
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 5:37 pm Posts: 3170 Location: clegavel
|
psynvrn wrote: magikoopa wrote: but also how many steel moves could a steel type actually learn the only 2 good ones are steel wing and gyro ball so steel i think is actually has to many weeeknesses
You forgot iron tail. And the weaknesses isn't that much.
The weaknesses of Steel are Fire, Fighting and Ground.
And I believe the three most commonly used moves in competitive play are EQ, Brick Break, and Surf (in no particular order). It's not so broken after all, but Steel types don't tend to be that fast (Metagross, Skarmory, and Lucario are exceptions, but even so there are much faster things), but they make up for it with high defenses.
Shame there are so few Steel moves, but they all involve an extra effect, usually involving a possible boost of the USER'S stat, something rarely ever seen (except in Ancientpower etc.)
- DNA
|
Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:15 pm |
|
|
Ace
Pokemon Ranger
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:10 pm Posts: 684 Location: AU
|
But have you ever thought of the common, yet powerful move Earthquake???
|
Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:15 am |
|
|
PalletAsh
Bug Catcher
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:37 am Posts: 23
|
very good observation, i think that steel is overpowered too,BUT steel is also limited
how many steel pokemon do you find?
how many steel attacks do you find?
these are also factors at which you must consider, Quote: but also how many steel moves could a steel type actually learn the only 2 good ones are steel wing and gyro ball so steel i think is actually has to many weeeknesses also meteor mash...so, yeah steel is strong but it does have only a couple of attacks that are actually good gyro ball for example is a good move,IF your pokemon is slow steel wing is good,IF your pokemon that learns it is a flying type
the problem with steel wing is that steel=flying=physical=attack
bird=speed!
steel wing is only good for a pokemon such as skarmory which has a decent attack but slow speed
so if you are looking for steel pokemon get either a metagross or a skarmory[/quote]
|
Sat Nov 10, 2007 4:01 pm |
|
|
sanjay120
Dragon Tamer
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2007 1:43 pm Posts: 117
|
The only good Steel attacking moves are Gyro Ball, Iron Head, and Meteor Mash. And they're only for STAB. They're resisted by bulky waters, random bulky electrics like Zapdos, and other Steels. And without Steel's resist to Dragon, which btw comes from Japanese folklore about dragons being afraid of steel, Specsmence would reign.
|
Sun Nov 11, 2007 6:26 am |
|
|
|
|
Page 1 of 1
|
[ 20 posts ] |
|
Who is online |
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 17 guests |
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum
|
|