I saw Dusknoirs attack stat and it doesn't look to bad meh
I thought that this would be a good topic to discuss so does it make a good one what do you think?

It's not fast enough, and its attack stat isn't enough to make up for that.

Have you seen his defenses? Dusknoir is a tank. Could use more HP though.

Dusknoir is good as a mixed wall, you could make it a physical wall, or a special wall. It's also good for countering the most common Rapid-Spinners in the game that might try to foil your Stealth Rock/Spikes. To make up for its poor speed, a lot of people will give it Shadow Sneak which, given the right EVs and nature, will 2HKO Starmie. Even if you don't do an "Anti-Spinner" set, Will O Wisp is a common move for Dusky because it's good team support.

In any set that is defensive on Dusknoir though (it would be dumb not to use Dusknoir defensively) you'll want to max out its terrible HP.

i has a wide variety of moves (type wise) i like to teach it ice punch thunder punch shadow punch and will o wisp it works i guess meh

yeah, it is a good wall. i think you could add a WOW to make it even more effective in that role?

yes.

Something like
Dusknoir @ Lefties
252 HP / 129 Atk / 129 Def
WoW
Snadow Sneak / Shadow Punch
Ice Punch / Earthquake
Pain Split / Rest

I say it's best as a wall and annoyer.

There is a idea thta make him one of the faster sweepers around...

Use him in Trick Room abusers team with max Att and Hp,Relaxed or Brave nature....

I'd rather have a Curse-Trapper, Sion. It's the only one who can pull this effectively.

(too lazy to post the EV and Nature stuff)
~ Curse
~ Mean Look
~ Pain Split
~ Protect

Switch in a Rapid Spin, trap than Curse. Pain Split to recover lost HP from Curse. Then abuse Protect haxx until they D1e1!!1

EEEBIL.

Thats Pretty Damn nice. Yet another use For Dusknoir!

Now FaceLess you can come and insult me.

Well, it's not like I do anything fancy, I just point out mistakes you make unless they are particularly offensive ones. For the record, I was going to leave this alone, because it wasn't officially advice and not all tragically bad. But if you insist I'd hate to think I disappointed.

That set could work, but not the way you're thinking. I mean, if you mean looked first, they have the chance to switch in whoever they think can take dusknoir, and often times that means you'll have to switch out.

If you successfully trap something though, it gets a couple turns to mess with you since it's a multi phase process.

I think the best thing that could be done, even though I have no idea how you'd do it, is trap Blissey or some other non attack tank.

I think the worst thing that can be done, is to through failed attempts and forced switches be entirely unable to come back into play without dieing leaving the pokemon as dead weight.

Consider pairing this Dusknoir with umbreon for trap passing and dangerous mind games. Unfortunately no matter what you do dusknoir's either taking substantial damage, receiving status affects or letting something spike up, or some combination of those. Unless you teach him substitute, then the only status he has to worry about is yawn.

Too bad painsplit doesn't make a huge difference after cursing. But if you manage to survive well enough, relying on pure luck, you could do this more than once a battle with leftovers.

Now I'd like to thank FaceLess for the nifty insult.

This set was officially meant to be a anti-spinner if ya will, sir.

Switch in a Rapid Spin than Mean Look. It usually goes last so they cannot switch out next turn.

Curse, and recover with Pain Split. Sir, I really cannot see a strategy that can screw this up except Taunt and Roar/WW. Switch in a RS, go last and trap, then Curse+Split. Abuse Protect hax until they die.

The strategy under this is to get rid of their spinner and then set up (SR)/(Toxi)Spikes, sir. I use a Skarm to support this guy. SR, AAce, Spikes, Roost. Set up SR, then Roost if needed while continiually Spiking and Roaring.

I have used this with some success on Shoddy, thank you and have a nice day sir.

And nao I r wait 4 counter insultz. !1&1!1!!1!!1!!!111

On the mean look turn the spinner switches out or attacks, Gnaaye. That was the problem I outlined. Switch completely botches it. If you switch in a rapid spin and they say.. Attack, you have to take 2 hits, 3 if they've played you before and hit you on the switch in, Then you curse losing 50% health, then the next turn you try to pain split and they have One more chance to KO you.

Now, All the spinners I've used and heard of competitively, can do something in those 3-4 turns to do 50% damage, or they'd switch out, or they'd make the sacrifice to spike up or something.

More importantly a people with my particular playing style, by no means a majority or mingority or particularly special, have pokemon they switch to that battles dusknoir, and since that set has no attacking abilities, and painsplits effectiveness is weakened but the spikes/rocks, You'll have to switch out most of the time for the first encounter and every time for every encounter onward.

Yeah, and I've used my Sub punching no speed fire blast baton pass blaiziken with nothing but success on there. Doesn't mean it isn't a novelty set.

(Final anecdote edited so that my point isn't lost in it)

lol I guess that theres no clear answer then

why dont you guys just grow up with the whole "insult" thing.

gnaaye suggested a set. faceless didnt like it (either do i). i didnt see any insults there, by anyone. not this time anyway. i mean this is just a forum right? you dont really know each other. why dont we just pretend nothing has ever happened, and go back to just being anonymous names on a pokemon forum.

my reasons for not liking the curse etc set is that

1) on the turn you use mean look, your opponent will probably have switched to a dusknoir counter. this means that if you try the curse thing, they wont just have to KO you 100%, they will only have to KO you 50%. a true counter should be able to do that EASILY.

2) this means you will have to switch out after mean look (wasted turn). AND now they know your trick. so next time their starmie (say) goes in to use rapid spin they know you will bring in dusknoir. instead of using rapid spin, they will use surf. then instead of switching when you do mean look, they stay and do surf again. by this stage, your dusknoir doesnt even have enough HP to use curse, especially since starmie will get ANOTHER suf before you even use curse. you will probably get to use it, but your health will be all gone, and starmie can just switch out.

in my opinion, dusknoir is a great anti-spinner. it has good attack, and good moves to make most spinners run. it can learn shadow punch to take care of starmie and claydol; ice punch for donphan; fire punch for forretress; earthquake for torkoal. (ive probably forgotten a few common spinners.) and its got the defenses to switch in at the right time. pity it didnt get levitate instead of pressure.....

*enter - head rater in sinnoh/hoenn/johto/kanto*

What in tarnation - my god...

1.) A specific moveset for dusknoir is up for debate in the specific discussion of all pokemon in detail sticky: http://www.psypokes.com/forums/viewtopi ... 726#294726
2.) http://www.psypokes.com/forums/viewtopi ... &start=680 Sinnoh rating center
3.) http://psypokes.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=13868 the standard moveset guide - not nearly impeccle, but use it as a launching pad

and finally:

4.) http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20971 the official smogon analysis. See the discussion, see the reasoning. Involves complex EV training, IV breeding, etc.

Also, end the flame war.


P.S. - here's one:

Dusknoir @Choice Band
Adamant | 252 Atk, 252 HP, 6 Speed
~Shadow Punch
~Focus Punch
~Thunderpunch
~Ice Punch

Anti-spin (mini-boltbeam counters 2 main spinners) normal hitter. Ghost + fighting has no resist, bolt-beam is a DUH.

Happy. I did that without even looking at the smogon set that much. I saw 4 decent moves. END OF STORY!